MPs slam the burglary sentence of Craig Real after his release from jail for killing Big Issue seller Ralph Millward

"Astonishing" - MPs slam teen killer's burglary sentence and vow to refer it to the attorney general

Craig Real

Ralph Millward

Bournemouth West MP Conor Burns

First published in News
Last updated
by

THE sentence of a teenage killer who burgled a summer house just weeks after his release from jail has been slammed by Bournemouth’s MPs.

Craig Real was spared a further jail term for his TV-snatching raid in Monkton Crescent, Poole, when Recorder Richard Onslow ruled he should receive a 12 month community order as it was his first burglary.

“Do not regard this as a let off, you should regard it as a chance to change your life,” he said at Bournemouth Crown Court.

Real, now 21, was one of three teenagers who kicked Big Issue seller Ralph Millward to death in Westbourne five years ago. He was jailed for manslaughter, but released in February this year.

Bournemouth East and West MPs Tobias Ellwood and Conor Burns said they would refer the “astonishing” sentence to the attorney general.

“I am astonished, the magistrates had clearly determined a minimum sentence of six months and were looking for something stronger,” said Mr Ellwood.

“This was clearly not his first crime, you don’t somehow move into a different category of crime and have your past misdeeds wiped clean.”

Mr Burns said: “This young man was very lucky that he wasn’t eligible for an adult sentence for the despicable crime he committed in Westbourne.

“The fact that he has emerged from prison and is clearly addicted to a life of crime shows the criminal justice system is not working.”

Prosecuting, Nick Robinson said the victims had felt “violated” as a result of the burglary, which happened overnight between April 16 and 17 this year, just yards from the home of Real's girlfriend.

He said the defendant claimed when arrested that he had visited the house legitimately many years ago leaving fingerprints at the scene, but his victim said they had never met.

Robert Grey, mitigating, pointed out that there was no damage to the property. “He went into the summer house because he was homeless,” he said.

Real was ordered to pay £250 compensation and to attend a Thinking Skills programme.

  • Ralph Millward, 41, was kicked and left for dead near his pitch outside Marks & Spencer in Westbourne after he refused to give his tobacco to Real and co-defendants Warren Crago and Jimmy Ayres.

Real, then of Rossmore, Poole, was the oldest of the group at almost 17.

After the savage attack on popular Mr Millward, Real returned to the scene to push a shopping trolley into his body as he lay seriously injured on the ground.

All three admitted manslaughter in 2010, and Real was jailed for four years and nine months.

Comments (46)

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4:46pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Tig says...

“He went into the summer house because he was homeless,” Ah, the irony. Ralph Millward was homeless and he was kicked to death. Craig is so very lucky to have been given another chance. Ralph didn't get that.
“He went into the summer house because he was homeless,” Ah, the irony. Ralph Millward was homeless and he was kicked to death. Craig is so very lucky to have been given another chance. Ralph didn't get that. Tig
  • Score: 136

4:48pm Fri 11 Jul 14

The Real Judge Judy says...

....Obviously NOT rehabilitated during his pathetic sentence for manslaughter !! Hurry Up Karma !!
....Obviously NOT rehabilitated during his pathetic sentence for manslaughter !! Hurry Up Karma !! The Real Judge Judy
  • Score: 110

4:58pm Fri 11 Jul 14

billy bumble says...

Bring back hanging
Bring back hanging billy bumble
  • Score: 72

4:58pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Controversial But True says...

Lock him up with Rolf Harris! I'm sure 'One Little Boy' would be enough!
Lock him up with Rolf Harris! I'm sure 'One Little Boy' would be enough! Controversial But True
  • Score: 67

5:00pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Bournemouth87 says...

Tobias Elwood needs to ensure this man/boy is sent to jail. This is his responsability and am fed up of him saying everything right but not following through.
Tobias Elwood needs to ensure this man/boy is sent to jail. This is his responsability and am fed up of him saying everything right but not following through. Bournemouth87
  • Score: 82

5:02pm Fri 11 Jul 14

boyerboy says...

Amazing sentence...would seem this Recorder is perhaps a " new boy" ? - certainly is not a full time judge - and nor should he be.

I do hope this charming little criminal gets re sentenced and what about his early release "under licence", surely his licence should be revoked?

I do hope Mr Onslow is suitably re-trained and is removed from our Court Circuit PLEASE.
Amazing sentence...would seem this Recorder is perhaps a " new boy" ? - certainly is not a full time judge - and nor should he be. I do hope this charming little criminal gets re sentenced and what about his early release "under licence", surely his licence should be revoked? I do hope Mr Onslow is suitably re-trained and is removed from our Court Circuit PLEASE. boyerboy
  • Score: 76

5:08pm Fri 11 Jul 14

kinsonjim says...

Sadly he is typical of so many of todays youngsters. They think they are free to do just as they please, and all the time we have these 'soft hearted' magistrates they will get away with it. What a future for our country when 'they' are in, so called 'charge', of their own destiny. The way they are going on there will be one thing, there will be nothing for them to steal because no one will have anything.
Sadly he is typical of so many of todays youngsters. They think they are free to do just as they please, and all the time we have these 'soft hearted' magistrates they will get away with it. What a future for our country when 'they' are in, so called 'charge', of their own destiny. The way they are going on there will be one thing, there will be nothing for them to steal because no one will have anything. kinsonjim
  • Score: 38

5:20pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Chukki's uncle says...

A thinking skills programme ? That could be difficult when you are lacking one important commodity .... i.e a brain
A thinking skills programme ? That could be difficult when you are lacking one important commodity .... i.e a brain Chukki's uncle
  • Score: 54

5:22pm Fri 11 Jul 14

PokesdownMark says...

The maj followed quite rigid guidelines. But sadly this individual has a rather notorious history. The proverbial exception to the rule?
The maj followed quite rigid guidelines. But sadly this individual has a rather notorious history. The proverbial exception to the rule? PokesdownMark
  • Score: 17

5:39pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Gingertree says...

Ordered to pay £250 well out of his dole that'll be about 5p a week He is scum His family is scum Bring back boot camp style Borstal The little turd wouldn't last a weekend
Ordered to pay £250 well out of his dole that'll be about 5p a week He is scum His family is scum Bring back boot camp style Borstal The little turd wouldn't last a weekend Gingertree
  • Score: 85

6:03pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Arjay says...

Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone.

The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better.
Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated.
The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again
Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone. The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better. Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated. The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again Arjay
  • Score: 44

6:51pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Ayles 10 says...

Absolutely disgusted reading this
Absolutely disgusted reading this Ayles 10
  • Score: 34

6:58pm Fri 11 Jul 14

rob.carter says...

Scum killed an innocent man now burglary this sad excuse for a human is destined for a life of crime. Longer sentence in harder conditions may be a deterrent. At the moment prison is too soft and us not a deterrent to anyone.
Scum killed an innocent man now burglary this sad excuse for a human is destined for a life of crime. Longer sentence in harder conditions may be a deterrent. At the moment prison is too soft and us not a deterrent to anyone. rob.carter
  • Score: 46

7:15pm Fri 11 Jul 14

eaststandman says...

His 'mother' and 'father' must be so proud.........

Yet another one who should be connected to the mains...........
His 'mother' and 'father' must be so proud......... Yet another one who should be connected to the mains........... eaststandman
  • Score: 34

7:38pm Fri 11 Jul 14

mableone says...

kinsonjim wrote:
Sadly he is typical of so many of todays youngsters. They think they are free to do just as they please, and all the time we have these 'soft hearted' magistrates they will get away with it. What a future for our country when 'they' are in, so called 'charge', of their own destiny. The way they are going on there will be one thing, there will be nothing for them to steal because no one will have anything.
Please consider what you wrote again.

The Magistrates sent him to the Crown Court for sentencing because, they took the view that their sentencing powers, (6months), were not sufficient.
[quote][p][bold]kinsonjim[/bold] wrote: Sadly he is typical of so many of todays youngsters. They think they are free to do just as they please, and all the time we have these 'soft hearted' magistrates they will get away with it. What a future for our country when 'they' are in, so called 'charge', of their own destiny. The way they are going on there will be one thing, there will be nothing for them to steal because no one will have anything.[/p][/quote]Please consider what you wrote again. The Magistrates sent him to the Crown Court for sentencing because, they took the view that their sentencing powers, (6months), were not sufficient. mableone
  • Score: 14

7:43pm Fri 11 Jul 14

mableone says...

The Magistrates committed him to the Crown Court for sentencing. The reason being that they considered that their sentencing powers were insufficient. In cases such as this they felt that their 6 month maximum was not long enough and can commit to the Crown Court.
A good judgement on their part, I think.
The Magistrates committed him to the Crown Court for sentencing. The reason being that they considered that their sentencing powers were insufficient. In cases such as this they felt that their 6 month maximum was not long enough and can commit to the Crown Court. A good judgement on their part, I think. mableone
  • Score: 17

7:49pm Fri 11 Jul 14

mableone says...

Arjay wrote:
Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone.

The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better.
Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated.
The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again
Judges are held to account, the local MP's have asked for the sentence to be considered by the Attorney General. It could be increased. I wish people would read and understand what they read before commenting.
[quote][p][bold]Arjay[/bold] wrote: Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone. The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better. Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated. The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again[/p][/quote]Judges are held to account, the local MP's have asked for the sentence to be considered by the Attorney General. It could be increased. I wish people would read and understand what they read before commenting. mableone
  • Score: -4

8:19pm Fri 11 Jul 14

billy bumble says...

mableone wrote:
Arjay wrote:
Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone.

The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better.
Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated.
The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again
Judges are held to account, the local MP's have asked for the sentence to be considered by the Attorney General. It could be increased. I wish people would read and understand what they read before commenting.
I am not aware of any automatic system of our judges being "held to account" - could you maybe expand on this?
[quote][p][bold]mableone[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Arjay[/bold] wrote: Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone. The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better. Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated. The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again[/p][/quote]Judges are held to account, the local MP's have asked for the sentence to be considered by the Attorney General. It could be increased. I wish people would read and understand what they read before commenting.[/p][/quote]I am not aware of any automatic system of our judges being "held to account" - could you maybe expand on this? billy bumble
  • Score: 12

8:26pm Fri 11 Jul 14

dustbindanny says...

He went into the summer house because he was homeless???? Yet his girlfriend lived nearby, why didn't he stay at her accommodation ?.? it,s always the Victims that suffer never the Criminal, welcome to British Justice 2014!
He went into the summer house because he was homeless???? Yet his girlfriend lived nearby, why didn't he stay at her accommodation ?.? it,s always the Victims that suffer never the Criminal, welcome to British Justice 2014! dustbindanny
  • Score: 36

8:28pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Bob49 says...

"he should receive a 12 month community order as it was his first burglary. "

wasn't it his first murder as well ?



ps nice to see yet another solicitor picking up a fat wedge for coming out with more old sh. ite .............. " “He went into the summer house because he was homeless"

I doubt even he believes that
"he should receive a 12 month community order as it was his first burglary. " wasn't it his first murder as well ? ps nice to see yet another solicitor picking up a fat wedge for coming out with more old sh. ite .............. " “He went into the summer house because he was homeless" I doubt even he believes that Bob49
  • Score: 31

9:39pm Fri 11 Jul 14

Jonwel says...

The Scum are winning.
The Scum are winning. Jonwel
  • Score: 19

9:49pm Fri 11 Jul 14

bennysmith says...

After reading this article I was first shocked about the fact that he was only done for 'Manslaughter' in the first place? Kicking someone to there last breath and then ramming a trolly into them isn't just murder, It's a horrific murder that only someone who isn't right in the head would commit.

I've never agreed with the death penalty but what exactly is this little boy ever going to contribute towards society. He's a baby faced **** and his mouth irritates me too.

I tell you, if he came into my house and I hit him with a baseball bat and he died, I'd get the full force of the justice system and would be sent away for murder. Why are criminals being protected. Just don't get it anymore...
After reading this article I was first shocked about the fact that he was only done for 'Manslaughter' in the first place? Kicking someone to there last breath and then ramming a trolly into them isn't just murder, It's a horrific murder that only someone who isn't right in the head would commit. I've never agreed with the death penalty but what exactly is this little boy ever going to contribute towards society. He's a baby faced **** and his mouth irritates me too. I tell you, if he came into my house and I hit him with a baseball bat and he died, I'd get the full force of the justice system and would be sent away for murder. Why are criminals being protected. Just don't get it anymore... bennysmith
  • Score: 38

7:05am Sat 12 Jul 14

itsneverblackorwhite says...

the recorder at Crown court was obviously trained by Judge Wiggs!
the recorder at Crown court was obviously trained by Judge Wiggs! itsneverblackorwhite
  • Score: 11

7:39am Sat 12 Jul 14

Fingersonthem says...

I thought the usual excuse for being where you should not be was "I was looking for my ball"

Mind you we could say the same about this layout this morning I am lost
I thought the usual excuse for being where you should not be was "I was looking for my ball" Mind you we could say the same about this layout this morning I am lost Fingersonthem
  • Score: 6

7:44am Sat 12 Jul 14

Fingersonthem says...

Fingersonthem wrote:
I thought the usual excuse for being where you should not be was "I was looking for my ball"

Mind you we could say the same about this layout this morning I am lost
Found my way back to the desktop layout all is forgiven.
[quote][p][bold]Fingersonthem[/bold] wrote: I thought the usual excuse for being where you should not be was "I was looking for my ball" Mind you we could say the same about this layout this morning I am lost[/p][/quote]Found my way back to the desktop layout all is forgiven. Fingersonthem
  • Score: 0

9:31am Sat 12 Jul 14

podgie says...

Dear Mr Burns
When these Judges who we pay squillions and put up in grand houses with servants etc , act like complete out of touch,Feck wits,can we sack them,parade them through the streets and invite the public to insert a pineapple in any orifice they think fit.....
Dear Mr Burns When these Judges who we pay squillions and put up in grand houses with servants etc , act like complete out of touch,Feck wits,can we sack them,parade them through the streets and invite the public to insert a pineapple in any orifice they think fit..... podgie
  • Score: 6

10:21am Sat 12 Jul 14

pete woodley says...

podgie wrote:
Dear Mr Burns
When these Judges who we pay squillions and put up in grand houses with servants etc , act like complete out of touch,Feck wits,can we sack them,parade them through the streets and invite the public to insert a pineapple in any orifice they think fit.....
What language are you speaking what is "feck wits" and what is your obsession with orifices.I suppose being crude makes you feel better.
[quote][p][bold]podgie[/bold] wrote: Dear Mr Burns When these Judges who we pay squillions and put up in grand houses with servants etc , act like complete out of touch,Feck wits,can we sack them,parade them through the streets and invite the public to insert a pineapple in any orifice they think fit.....[/p][/quote]What language are you speaking what is "feck wits" and what is your obsession with orifices.I suppose being crude makes you feel better. pete woodley
  • Score: -4

12:00pm Sat 12 Jul 14

downmoor-ch63 says...

Making a mockery of justice AGAIN, this type of INJUSTICE to the general public should not happen again, BRING IN NEW LAWS dammit, LAWS THAT DEFEND NOT ENCOURAGE, these THUGS ,BURGLERS, KILLERS, SCUM , etc ,INCREASE THE POLICE FORCE NOT DECEMATE THEM !!, OR GO UNDER, YOUR CHOICE!.
Making a mockery of justice AGAIN, this type of INJUSTICE to the general public should not happen again, BRING IN NEW LAWS dammit, LAWS THAT DEFEND NOT ENCOURAGE, these THUGS ,BURGLERS, KILLERS, SCUM , etc ,INCREASE THE POLICE FORCE NOT DECEMATE THEM !!, OR GO UNDER, YOUR CHOICE!. downmoor-ch63
  • Score: 9

12:03pm Sat 12 Jul 14

rozmister says...

kinsonjim wrote:
Sadly he is typical of so many of todays youngsters. They think they are free to do just as they please, and all the time we have these 'soft hearted' magistrates they will get away with it. What a future for our country when 'they' are in, so called 'charge', of their own destiny. The way they are going on there will be one thing, there will be nothing for them to steal because no one will have anything.
If you look at the In the Dock record every day thefts and other crimes are committed by people of all ages, it's not just 'many of today's youngsters'. The vast majority of young people are fine but as a country we have an under belly of scum who live on the proceeds of crime and are violent towards those who cross their path. That under belly's age varies from teenagers to the elderly. It's about mentality not how many years you've been alive.
[quote][p][bold]kinsonjim[/bold] wrote: Sadly he is typical of so many of todays youngsters. They think they are free to do just as they please, and all the time we have these 'soft hearted' magistrates they will get away with it. What a future for our country when 'they' are in, so called 'charge', of their own destiny. The way they are going on there will be one thing, there will be nothing for them to steal because no one will have anything.[/p][/quote]If you look at the In the Dock record every day thefts and other crimes are committed by people of all ages, it's not just 'many of today's youngsters'. The vast majority of young people are fine but as a country we have an under belly of scum who live on the proceeds of crime and are violent towards those who cross their path. That under belly's age varies from teenagers to the elderly. It's about mentality not how many years you've been alive. rozmister
  • Score: 19

1:18pm Sat 12 Jul 14

Arjay says...

billy bumble wrote:
mableone wrote:
Arjay wrote:
Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone.

The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better.
Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated.
The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again
Judges are held to account, the local MP's have asked for the sentence to be considered by the Attorney General. It could be increased. I wish people would read and understand what they read before commenting.
I am not aware of any automatic system of our judges being "held to account" - could you maybe expand on this?
No expansion or clarification as yet from mableone -- I too am looking forward to reading about how judges are currently held to account?

The official response seems to consists of their being held to account by 'explanatory accountability' ---which seems to means that a judge may be asked to explain WHY he (or she) has arrived at a particular decision?

Hmmm... not sure that concept is currently working very well?

I'm sure mableone will enlighten us further in due course.....
[quote][p][bold]billy bumble[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]mableone[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Arjay[/bold] wrote: Yet another example of an 'out of touch' judge. Although in this part of the world it is usually Judge Wiggs who is the one to issue ridiculously lenient sentences for serious crimes, he's clearly not alone. The sooner the system is modernised, so that judges can be held accountable for their actions the better. Whether that means by the introduction of elections for judicial appointments, or some other process would need to be debated. The system as it stands is clearly not fit for purpose... as this case shows yet again[/p][/quote]Judges are held to account, the local MP's have asked for the sentence to be considered by the Attorney General. It could be increased. I wish people would read and understand what they read before commenting.[/p][/quote]I am not aware of any automatic system of our judges being "held to account" - could you maybe expand on this?[/p][/quote]No expansion or clarification as yet from mableone -- I too am looking forward to reading about how judges are currently held to account? The official response seems to consists of their being held to account by 'explanatory accountability' ---which seems to means that a judge may be asked to explain WHY he (or she) has arrived at a particular decision? Hmmm... not sure that concept is currently working very well? I'm sure mableone will enlighten us further in due course..... Arjay
  • Score: 2

2:25pm Sat 12 Jul 14

simong says...

These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s!
These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s! simong
  • Score: 7

2:29pm Sat 12 Jul 14

DUCKFEEDER says...

He has a girlfriend,strange this love thing is
He has a girlfriend,strange this love thing is DUCKFEEDER
  • Score: 5

2:59pm Sat 12 Jul 14

Bob49 says...

simong wrote:
These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s!
oh dear, someone been at the Mail again

maybe you should cut the usage down and ask if it is the case why everybody else is not engaging in such behaviour

or maybe look at where the idea of freedom of thought and tolerance (liberal) is scorned (USA) and they have the kind of draconian punishments you apear to want their rate of crime is actually around 5 times higher than the so called 'liberal' countries

as to the country being ruined, maybe it is just the bit you live in
[quote][p][bold]simong[/bold] wrote: These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s![/p][/quote]oh dear, someone been at the Mail again maybe you should cut the usage down and ask if it is the case why everybody else is not engaging in such behaviour or maybe look at where the idea of freedom of thought and tolerance (liberal) is scorned (USA) and they have the kind of draconian punishments you apear to want their rate of crime is actually around 5 times higher than the so called 'liberal' countries as to the country being ruined, maybe it is just the bit you live in Bob49
  • Score: -4

4:03pm Sat 12 Jul 14

breamoreboy says...

boyerboy wrote:
Amazing sentence...would seem this Recorder is perhaps a " new boy" ? - certainly is not a full time judge - and nor should he be.

I do hope this charming little criminal gets re sentenced and what about his early release "under licence", surely his licence should be revoked?

I do hope Mr Onslow is suitably re-trained and is removed from our Court Circuit PLEASE.
I'm still proud of the late Reg Lawton of the Bat and Ball Breamore and the Bournemouth Echo for raising a petition back in the 1970s that got 250,000 signatures. This followed the death of Ken Green. His killers got two year sentences for burglary but one year sentences for manslaughter. There was no appeal for the prosecution against sentencing in those days, thanks to our petition and the work of others that followed up there is now!!!
[quote][p][bold]boyerboy[/bold] wrote: Amazing sentence...would seem this Recorder is perhaps a " new boy" ? - certainly is not a full time judge - and nor should he be. I do hope this charming little criminal gets re sentenced and what about his early release "under licence", surely his licence should be revoked? I do hope Mr Onslow is suitably re-trained and is removed from our Court Circuit PLEASE.[/p][/quote]I'm still proud of the late Reg Lawton of the Bat and Ball Breamore and the Bournemouth Echo for raising a petition back in the 1970s that got 250,000 signatures. This followed the death of Ken Green. His killers got two year sentences for burglary but one year sentences for manslaughter. There was no appeal for the prosecution against sentencing in those days, thanks to our petition and the work of others that followed up there is now!!! breamoreboy
  • Score: 4

6:29pm Sat 12 Jul 14

breamoreboy says...

dustbindanny wrote:
He went into the summer house because he was homeless???? Yet his girlfriend lived nearby, why didn't he stay at her accommodation ?.? it,s always the Victims that suffer never the Criminal, welcome to British Justice 2014!
British justice? I thought that the Scottish system was still separate from that in England and Wales.
[quote][p][bold]dustbindanny[/bold] wrote: He went into the summer house because he was homeless???? Yet his girlfriend lived nearby, why didn't he stay at her accommodation ?.? it,s always the Victims that suffer never the Criminal, welcome to British Justice 2014![/p][/quote]British justice? I thought that the Scottish system was still separate from that in England and Wales. breamoreboy
  • Score: -2

6:33pm Sat 12 Jul 14

chucky251 says...

what a loser simple as.
what a loser simple as. chucky251
  • Score: 0

8:00pm Sat 12 Jul 14

Wageslave says...

rob.carter wrote:
Scum killed an innocent man now burglary this sad excuse for a human is destined for a life of crime. Longer sentence in harder conditions may be a deterrent. At the moment prison is too soft and us not a deterrent to anyone.
And there are too few prison places. We do not have a need for more houses (for immigrants or Chinese investors) what we need to build are more PRISONS.
[quote][p][bold]rob.carter[/bold] wrote: Scum killed an innocent man now burglary this sad excuse for a human is destined for a life of crime. Longer sentence in harder conditions may be a deterrent. At the moment prison is too soft and us not a deterrent to anyone.[/p][/quote]And there are too few prison places. We do not have a need for more houses (for immigrants or Chinese investors) what we need to build are more PRISONS. Wageslave
  • Score: 4

9:09pm Sat 12 Jul 14

simong says...

Bob49 wrote:
simong wrote:
These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s!
oh dear, someone been at the Mail again

maybe you should cut the usage down and ask if it is the case why everybody else is not engaging in such behaviour

or maybe look at where the idea of freedom of thought and tolerance (liberal) is scorned (USA) and they have the kind of draconian punishments you apear to want their rate of crime is actually around 5 times higher than the so called 'liberal' countries

as to the country being ruined, maybe it is just the bit you live in
Yawn. Come on, surely you can do better than trot out the tired old 'Mail reader' retort which says far more about you than it does me. To suggest that we should simply tolerate this sort of behaviour I'd, at a guess, suggest your reading level hasn't gone much further than the type of publications that require you to keep one hand free.
[quote][p][bold]Bob49[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]simong[/bold] wrote: These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s![/p][/quote]oh dear, someone been at the Mail again maybe you should cut the usage down and ask if it is the case why everybody else is not engaging in such behaviour or maybe look at where the idea of freedom of thought and tolerance (liberal) is scorned (USA) and they have the kind of draconian punishments you apear to want their rate of crime is actually around 5 times higher than the so called 'liberal' countries as to the country being ruined, maybe it is just the bit you live in[/p][/quote]Yawn. Come on, surely you can do better than trot out the tired old 'Mail reader' retort which says far more about you than it does me. To suggest that we should simply tolerate this sort of behaviour I'd, at a guess, suggest your reading level hasn't gone much further than the type of publications that require you to keep one hand free. simong
  • Score: 4

9:32pm Sat 12 Jul 14

Bob49 says...

You do seem ratherly overly concerned with this onanism stuff. Something to tell perhaps ?

As to the Mail reader then I would add that if if looks like a duck ...etc

As to what we should tolerate perhaps you could point out where I stated that "we should simply tolerate this sort of behaviour ".
You do seem ratherly overly concerned with this onanism stuff. Something to tell perhaps ? As to the Mail reader then I would add that if if looks like a duck ...etc As to what we should tolerate perhaps you could point out where I stated that "we should simply tolerate this sort of behaviour ". Bob49
  • Score: -2

9:54pm Sat 12 Jul 14

simong says...

Bob49 (IQ ?). Go and re inflate your 'wife' and make the most of the rest of your evening. I'm off out with friends, if during the course of the evening we happen to kick to death an innocent, harmless individual it'll be re-assuring to know that there's at least one halfwit around who'll speak in our defence !
Bob49 (IQ ?). Go and re inflate your 'wife' and make the most of the rest of your evening. I'm off out with friends, if during the course of the evening we happen to kick to death an innocent, harmless individual it'll be re-assuring to know that there's at least one halfwit around who'll speak in our defence ! simong
  • Score: 6

11:52pm Sat 12 Jul 14

mpo1967 says...

one word to describe magistrate and criminal PATHETIC
one word to describe magistrate and criminal PATHETIC mpo1967
  • Score: 3

12:01am Sun 13 Jul 14

breamoreboy says...

simong wrote:
These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s!
It isn't just the liberal left, it's the whole of society. This has been slowly happening ever since the biggest revolution to hit this country, which was the social revolution that followed WWII. Yes things have gone too far, but I don't want things going back to the "good old days" when people were hanged for stealing a sheep. Let's get this country into the sensible middle ground.
[quote][p][bold]simong[/bold] wrote: These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s![/p][/quote]It isn't just the liberal left, it's the whole of society. This has been slowly happening ever since the biggest revolution to hit this country, which was the social revolution that followed WWII. Yes things have gone too far, but I don't want things going back to the "good old days" when people were hanged for stealing a sheep. Let's get this country into the sensible middle ground. breamoreboy
  • Score: -2

12:08am Sun 13 Jul 14

breamoreboy says...

mpo1967 wrote:
one word to describe magistrate and criminal PATHETIC
The same word could be used to describe people who don't bother to read the article properly. The magistrates decided that they couldn't hand out a stiff enough penalty. That is why the case was taken to Crown Court. Got it now?
[quote][p][bold]mpo1967[/bold] wrote: one word to describe magistrate and criminal PATHETIC[/p][/quote]The same word could be used to describe people who don't bother to read the article properly. The magistrates decided that they couldn't hand out a stiff enough penalty. That is why the case was taken to Crown Court. Got it now? breamoreboy
  • Score: 1

12:15am Sun 13 Jul 14

boardsandphotos says...

breamoreboy wrote:
simong wrote:
These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s!
It isn't just the liberal left, it's the whole of society. This has been slowly happening ever since the biggest revolution to hit this country, which was the social revolution that followed WWII. Yes things have gone too far, but I don't want things going back to the "good old days" when people were hanged for stealing a sheep. Let's get this country into the sensible middle ground.
I agree with you Breamoreboy.

This isn't going to win me any popularity contests but it's something for some of the posters on here to consider.

As far as all the comments about weak sentencing is concerned....

What do you suggest, that we use the U.S. model? It sounds logical but in reality harsh prison sentences do not work.

A few stats:

The U.S. has some of the harshest sentencing in the western world including the death penalty and yet they have a higher percentage of its citizens locked up in the same comparisson.

In 2007 the US had 5% of the worlds population but 23% of the world's prison population.

The U.S. is ranked third behind Saudi Arabia and Iran in the number of State sanctioned executions.

I'm not suggesting people don't go to prison, I'm not suggesting we send them to Disneyland either, but nor do I think you can simply lock someone up for years then let them out and expect them to integrate back into society without a better support structure. The 'bread and water treatment' doesn't work. The threat of longer sentencing doesn't work, the threat of the Death penalty doesn't work.

There has to be another answer, another way and education, therapy, support, combined with a period of loss of liberty and freedom all have to be part of that.

You can shout 'lock em up' and 'bring back hanging' etc if you want and if you want us to be up there being ranked with Saudi and Iran then great, but that's not a society I want to be part of, I do agree of course that some people should never be allowed out of prison.

We can all use emotions to come up with an answer, but most of the time that answer isn't the right one, an element of common sense needs to be used.
[quote][p][bold]breamoreboy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]simong[/bold] wrote: These types of incidents are a direct result of the liberal left getting their way over the years. Kids are brought up having a total disregard for authority as they know they can act with impunity. This country has been ruined by these w*****s![/p][/quote]It isn't just the liberal left, it's the whole of society. This has been slowly happening ever since the biggest revolution to hit this country, which was the social revolution that followed WWII. Yes things have gone too far, but I don't want things going back to the "good old days" when people were hanged for stealing a sheep. Let's get this country into the sensible middle ground.[/p][/quote]I agree with you Breamoreboy. This isn't going to win me any popularity contests but it's something for some of the posters on here to consider. As far as all the comments about weak sentencing is concerned.... What do you suggest, that we use the U.S. model? It sounds logical but in reality harsh prison sentences do not work. A few stats: The U.S. has some of the harshest sentencing in the western world including the death penalty and yet they have a higher percentage of its citizens locked up in the same comparisson. In 2007 the US had 5% of the worlds population but 23% of the world's prison population. The U.S. is ranked third behind Saudi Arabia and Iran in the number of State sanctioned executions. I'm not suggesting people don't go to prison, I'm not suggesting we send them to Disneyland either, but nor do I think you can simply lock someone up for years then let them out and expect them to integrate back into society without a better support structure. The 'bread and water treatment' doesn't work. The threat of longer sentencing doesn't work, the threat of the Death penalty doesn't work. There has to be another answer, another way and education, therapy, support, combined with a period of loss of liberty and freedom all have to be part of that. You can shout 'lock em up' and 'bring back hanging' etc if you want and if you want us to be up there being ranked with Saudi and Iran then great, but that's not a society I want to be part of, I do agree of course that some people should never be allowed out of prison. We can all use emotions to come up with an answer, but most of the time that answer isn't the right one, an element of common sense needs to be used. boardsandphotos
  • Score: 0

2:05pm Sun 13 Jul 14

boyerboy says...

mpo1967 wrote:
one word to describe magistrate and criminal PATHETIC
He is NOT a magistrate - this was a sentence at the " big boys court" - the Crown Court.

Magistrates can only offer a maximum sentence of six months.......the seriousness of the offence etc thus resulted in the case being heard at the Crown Court . The fact that Mr Onslow is a RECORDER means that he is NOT a full time judge( but heaven help us he could be planning to move into full time circuit Court work.....).
[quote][p][bold]mpo1967[/bold] wrote: one word to describe magistrate and criminal PATHETIC[/p][/quote]He is NOT a magistrate - this was a sentence at the " big boys court" - the Crown Court. Magistrates can only offer a maximum sentence of six months.......the seriousness of the offence etc thus resulted in the case being heard at the Crown Court . The fact that Mr Onslow is a RECORDER means that he is NOT a full time judge( but heaven help us he could be planning to move into full time circuit Court work.....). boyerboy
  • Score: 2

11:54pm Sun 13 Jul 14

Yankee1 says...

I am all for second chances.

But if he screws this up:

LIFE. NO PAROLE.
I am all for second chances. But if he screws this up: LIFE. NO PAROLE. Yankee1
  • Score: -1

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