UPDATE: Tony Ramsden quits chairmanship of FSB after Daily Echo story

Tony Ramsden arriving at Bournemouth Crown Court last year

Tony Ramsden arriving at Bournemouth Crown Court last year

First published in News
Last updated
by

CONVICTED criminal Tony Ramsden has resigned the chairmanship of his local Federation of Small Businesses after a Daily Echo report.

His appointment – months after he had been sent to jail and described as a “liability in business” – had provoked outrage.

Several members had told the Echo they could not remain with the federation as long as Mr Ramsden remained chairman of its Bournemouth, Poole and Christchurch branch.

In an email to a Federation of Small Busines ses (FSB) member, honorary national secretary Dave Stallon said: “I would confirm that Anthony Ramsden has resigned as the Bournemouth branch chairman.”

Mr Ramsden was jailed for 10 months last September for obtaining credit as an undisclosed bankrupt and five breaches of the Insolvency Act. Jailing him, Judge John Harrow said he was a “liability in business”.

Award-winning entrepreneur Sam Acton, who runs Domestic Angels in Southbourne, had cancelled her membership of the FSB on Friday.

She said at the weekend that the episode had “undermined the credibility” of the FSB.

She added: “If somebody’s going to represent small businesses, such as the FSB, then they’ve got to be people of the right moral standing and with the right business background.”

She had quit despite having received a “fantastic service” from the FSB in the past, she said.

Harry Seccombe, owner of Chaplins and the Cellar Bar and vice-chairman of Boscombe Forum, had also been seeking to quit.

He said yesterday: “It’s good that he’s resigned, which is the proper thing to do, but it should never have happened in the first place.

“I’ll still be asking questions about how they ended up in this position.”

Former Poole councillor Don Collier, who has been a member of the FSB for many years, said he was among many members who had not paid enough attention to the election.

“I’d really like FSB members to do what I’m going to do and pay more attention.

“It’s a good organisation and we shouldn’t allow this piece of silliness to detract from that,” he added.

“We the members are responsible.

“We are the people who let this happen.

“We can’t blame anyone but ourselves and if there is an officer who dropped the ball, I feel absolutely sure the FSB nationally will deal with them in the appropriate manner.”

Southbourne care home owner Geoff Rhodes, a member for many years, had said the appointment was “unbelievable” and he would not be renewing his membership while Mr Ramsden was in the post.

Mr Ramsden – whose father David is the branch secretary – was not available for comment.

Comments (63)

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10:32am Sat 15 Mar 14

BmthNewshound says...

Probably the only descent business decision this man has ever made.
Probably the only descent business decision this man has ever made. BmthNewshound
  • Score: 42

10:46am Sat 15 Mar 14

Tictock says...

I don't say this lightly or often, but WELL DONE ECHO in bring this to the general public's notice. A good example of local reporting.
I don't say this lightly or often, but WELL DONE ECHO in bring this to the general public's notice. A good example of local reporting. Tictock
  • Score: 71

10:46am Sat 15 Mar 14

Huey says...

Ahahahahahaha, good.
Let's hope he now disappears from public view.
Ahahahahahaha, good. Let's hope he now disappears from public view. Huey
  • Score: 33

10:46am Sat 15 Mar 14

theoraclexxxxx says...

Good and shame on the FSB in the first place. Meanwhile watch out....he may be coming to a business you are involved with soon.
Good and shame on the FSB in the first place. Meanwhile watch out....he may be coming to a business you are involved with soon. theoraclexxxxx
  • Score: 43

10:56am Sat 15 Mar 14

Glashen says...

Good, there are certain persons locally who don't seem to get the message, even after a criminal conviction and a spell in prison they seem to think they can resume their activities without consequences, hopefully they will start to get the message they can't.
-
Well done Echo.
Good, there are certain persons locally who don't seem to get the message, even after a criminal conviction and a spell in prison they seem to think they can resume their activities without consequences, hopefully they will start to get the message they can't. - Well done Echo. Glashen
  • Score: 44

10:59am Sat 15 Mar 14

billy bumble says...

Tictock wrote:
I don't say this lightly or often, but WELL DONE ECHO in bring this to the general public's notice. A good example of local reporting.
Ditto
[quote][p][bold]Tictock[/bold] wrote: I don't say this lightly or often, but WELL DONE ECHO in bring this to the general public's notice. A good example of local reporting.[/p][/quote]Ditto billy bumble
  • Score: 36

11:05am Sat 15 Mar 14

LordLilliput says...

The fact that he ever got to hold this position with such a well documented history of bankruptcy, dishonesty and deception coupled to him being recently released from prison for these crimes says more about the integrity of those running the FSB.

To the FSB:

What on earth were you thinking in appointing this man? Your reputation as a guiding light for small businesses has been for most I am sure, completely ruined. I think you owe it to all those that you have represented, that have placed their trust in you as an organisation to make a PUBLIC APOLOGY and EXPLAIN YOUR REASONS AND ACTIONS for attempting to place this man in a position of authority.

I look forward to your response, it's 'hands up' time guys - do the decent thing and at least TRY and make some amends for this appalling decision.
The fact that he ever got to hold this position with such a well documented history of bankruptcy, dishonesty and deception coupled to him being recently released from prison for these crimes says more about the integrity of those running the FSB. To the FSB: What on earth were you thinking in appointing this man? Your reputation as a guiding light for small businesses has been for most I am sure, completely ruined. I think you owe it to all those that you have represented, that have placed their trust in you as an organisation to make a PUBLIC APOLOGY and EXPLAIN YOUR REASONS AND ACTIONS for attempting to place this man in a position of authority. I look forward to your response, it's 'hands up' time guys - do the decent thing and at least TRY and make some amends for this appalling decision. LordLilliput
  • Score: 71

11:09am Sat 15 Mar 14

Bournemouth Ohec says...

Great news, and well done Echo for reporting the absurd appointment.
Great news, and well done Echo for reporting the absurd appointment. Bournemouth Ohec
  • Score: 36

11:35am Sat 15 Mar 14

LordLilliput says...

I'd also like to 'echo' the complimentary comments being made regarding the reporting of this story. As probably one of The Echo's biggest critics this is good journalism, highly relevant to the community and we'll presented. Excellent work.
I'd also like to 'echo' the complimentary comments being made regarding the reporting of this story. As probably one of The Echo's biggest critics this is good journalism, highly relevant to the community and we'll presented. Excellent work. LordLilliput
  • Score: 49

11:59am Sat 15 Mar 14

muscliffman says...

Well done Echo, now let's please keep this quality journalism flowing. especially as there should be at least one other departure from office in this matter alone!
Well done Echo, now let's please keep this quality journalism flowing. especially as there should be at least one other departure from office in this matter alone! muscliffman
  • Score: 38

12:17pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Arjay says...

Whilst this has got to be a positive step forward in this apparently farcical state of affairs, the credibility of the FSB - at least locally - must surely still remain in doubt?

The fact that those in positions of trust within this organisation locally even considered installing this man as their local chairman must surely cast into doubt their ability to make any rational business judgments, on behalf of others?

Add to that the fact that the organisation considers David Ramsden - another bankrupt - as a suitable person to be branch secretary must also cast doubt on their credibility as a 'useful' business organisation in general.
I can see membership numbers dropping away significantly, as more 'stable' business people reconsider the wisdom of belonging to the FSB....
Whilst this has got to be a positive step forward in this apparently farcical state of affairs, the credibility of the FSB - at least locally - must surely still remain in doubt? The fact that those in positions of trust within this organisation locally even considered installing this man as their local chairman must surely cast into doubt their ability to make any rational business judgments, on behalf of others? Add to that the fact that the organisation considers David Ramsden - another bankrupt - as a suitable person to be branch secretary must also cast doubt on their credibility as a 'useful' business organisation in general. I can see membership numbers dropping away significantly, as more 'stable' business people reconsider the wisdom of belonging to the FSB.... Arjay
  • Score: 33

12:28pm Sat 15 Mar 14

dvdr says...

This illustrates the power of the press to do good. I am glad the Echo found it and published it. Well done!
This illustrates the power of the press to do good. I am glad the Echo found it and published it. Well done! dvdr
  • Score: 29

12:48pm Sat 15 Mar 14

politicaltrainspotter says...

From where i am sat are we being told the full story or am i being cynical ? He must have been nominated and seconded and a list of prospective candidates for the chair must of be circulated to members.So who voted for him then ?

So the business people who resigned from the group or are intending to must question the constitution and those who put his name forward as they would of known of his conviction and bankruptcies.Even before his cell has been cleaned, he's in the news.

For one member who said ' he knew nothing of his past.'Where has he been?

So much as i congratulate the Daily Echo for publishiing the story, i still feel there is a lot more to come out.
From where i am sat are we being told the full story or am i being cynical ? He must have been nominated and seconded and a list of prospective candidates for the chair must of be circulated to members.So who voted for him then ? So the business people who resigned from the group or are intending to must question the constitution and those who put his name forward as they would of known of his conviction and bankruptcies.Even before his cell has been cleaned, he's in the news. For one member who said ' he knew nothing of his past.'Where has he been? So much as i congratulate the Daily Echo for publishiing the story, i still feel there is a lot more to come out. politicaltrainspotter
  • Score: 35

1:22pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Bob49 says...

Tthis must bring into question not only the judgement bu the integrity of those involved in this man's appointment.

The job of chairman in this case appears to be very 'hands on' and involved, yet his past record of dishonesty and deceoption seem to not matter.

This story has opened up what appears to be a murky world of croneyism and neoptism and should gives members cause for concern about what is happening inside this organisation.

Perhaps the Echo could tell us whether there was any fees/salary involved and what business Tony Ramsden was running that would have qualified him to join the federation of Small businesses.

His resignation should be the start of the enquiry, not the end.
Tthis must bring into question not only the judgement bu the integrity of those involved in this man's appointment. The job of chairman in this case appears to be very 'hands on' and involved, yet his past record of dishonesty and deceoption seem to not matter. This story has opened up what appears to be a murky world of croneyism and neoptism and should gives members cause for concern about what is happening inside this organisation. Perhaps the Echo could tell us whether there was any fees/salary involved and what business Tony Ramsden was running that would have qualified him to join the federation of Small businesses. His resignation should be the start of the enquiry, not the end. Bob49
  • Score: 31

1:24pm Sat 15 Mar 14

jinglebell says...

politicaltrainspotte
r
wrote:
From where i am sat are we being told the full story or am i being cynical ? He must have been nominated and seconded and a list of prospective candidates for the chair must of be circulated to members.So who voted for him then ?

So the business people who resigned from the group or are intending to must question the constitution and those who put his name forward as they would of known of his conviction and bankruptcies.Even before his cell has been cleaned, he's in the news.

For one member who said ' he knew nothing of his past.'Where has he been?

So much as i congratulate the Daily Echo for publishiing the story, i still feel there is a lot more to come out.
I totally agree the Echo needs to do more on this story for all the same reasons as political trainspotter states.
How secure is the voting system?
[quote][p][bold]politicaltrainspotte r[/bold] wrote: From where i am sat are we being told the full story or am i being cynical ? He must have been nominated and seconded and a list of prospective candidates for the chair must of be circulated to members.So who voted for him then ? So the business people who resigned from the group or are intending to must question the constitution and those who put his name forward as they would of known of his conviction and bankruptcies.Even before his cell has been cleaned, he's in the news. For one member who said ' he knew nothing of his past.'Where has he been? So much as i congratulate the Daily Echo for publishiing the story, i still feel there is a lot more to come out.[/p][/quote]I totally agree the Echo needs to do more on this story for all the same reasons as political trainspotter states. How secure is the voting system? jinglebell
  • Score: 23

1:30pm Sat 15 Mar 14

jinglebell says...

The FSB says that ordinary local members voted Ramsden in....but how on earth can that be the case, which is why the local branch and in particular the voting system needs a thorough vetting and investigation? You've done a great job Echo but don't stop now!
The FSB says that ordinary local members voted Ramsden in....but how on earth can that be the case, which is why the local branch and in particular the voting system needs a thorough vetting and investigation? You've done a great job Echo but don't stop now! jinglebell
  • Score: 19

1:31pm Sat 15 Mar 14

LordLilliput says...

Bob49 wrote:
Tthis must bring into question not only the judgement bu the integrity of those involved in this man's appointment.

The job of chairman in this case appears to be very 'hands on' and involved, yet his past record of dishonesty and deceoption seem to not matter.

This story has opened up what appears to be a murky world of croneyism and neoptism and should gives members cause for concern about what is happening inside this organisation.

Perhaps the Echo could tell us whether there was any fees/salary involved and what business Tony Ramsden was running that would have qualified him to join the federation of Small businesses.

His resignation should be the start of the enquiry, not the end.
Well said.
[quote][p][bold]Bob49[/bold] wrote: Tthis must bring into question not only the judgement bu the integrity of those involved in this man's appointment. The job of chairman in this case appears to be very 'hands on' and involved, yet his past record of dishonesty and deceoption seem to not matter. This story has opened up what appears to be a murky world of croneyism and neoptism and should gives members cause for concern about what is happening inside this organisation. Perhaps the Echo could tell us whether there was any fees/salary involved and what business Tony Ramsden was running that would have qualified him to join the federation of Small businesses. His resignation should be the start of the enquiry, not the end.[/p][/quote]Well said. LordLilliput
  • Score: 24

1:37pm Sat 15 Mar 14

The-Bleeding-Obvious says...

The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.
The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way. The-Bleeding-Obvious
  • Score: 20

2:16pm Sat 15 Mar 14

manyogie says...

Lets just hope he does`nt do a Carr and become a consultant to the FSB !
Lets just hope he does`nt do a Carr and become a consultant to the FSB ! manyogie
  • Score: 18

2:20pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Bob49 says...

The-Bleeding-Obvious wrote:
The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.
There should always be a case for rehabilitation into society - but there should also be a decent period of contrition.

One cause for concern here (amongst many others) is the speed of this appointment and the fact that his previous actions were not a 'one off' that could be put down to an abheration, but a mindset that saw him repeatedly fail to pay his debts.

The Echo should ask who nominated Tony Ramsden. What percentage of local members voted and how as that vote conducted.

It is now beholden on other FSB members and officials to make sure there is an open and tansparent investigation into this appointment, in order that credibility is restored and measures are put in place to ensure this sort of stuff doesn't happen again.

My fear though, is that the Echo may have only reported what was told to them and will not pursue this further - maybe too much light has been shone alteady and some will want this quietly forgotten

We shall see.
[quote][p][bold]The-Bleeding-Obvious[/bold] wrote: The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.[/p][/quote]There should always be a case for rehabilitation into society - but there should also be a decent period of contrition. One cause for concern here (amongst many others) is the speed of this appointment and the fact that his previous actions were not a 'one off' that could be put down to an abheration, but a mindset that saw him repeatedly fail to pay his debts. The Echo should ask who nominated Tony Ramsden. What percentage of local members voted and how as that vote conducted. It is now beholden on other FSB members and officials to make sure there is an open and tansparent investigation into this appointment, in order that credibility is restored and measures are put in place to ensure this sort of stuff doesn't happen again. My fear though, is that the Echo may have only reported what was told to them and will not pursue this further - maybe too much light has been shone alteady and some will want this quietly forgotten We shall see. Bob49
  • Score: 21

2:23pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Mangiafuoco says...

Christchurch councillor Colin Jamieson, a former regional officer with the FSB, said: “Tony is a very dynamic and forward-thinking person. I’m sure the FSB of Bournemouth, Poole and Christchurch would thrive under his leadership.”

Councillor Colin Jamieson must be a good pal of Mr Ramsden. After making such a crass public comment he should resign to!
Christchurch councillor Colin Jamieson, a former regional officer with the FSB, said: “Tony is a very dynamic and forward-thinking person. I’m sure the FSB of Bournemouth, Poole and Christchurch would thrive under his leadership.” Councillor Colin Jamieson must be a good pal of Mr Ramsden. After making such a crass public comment he should resign to! Mangiafuoco
  • Score: 37

2:25pm Sat 15 Mar 14

muscliffman says...

jinglebell wrote:
politicaltrainspotte

r
wrote:
From where i am sat are we being told the full story or am i being cynical ? He must have been nominated and seconded and a list of prospective candidates for the chair must of be circulated to members.So who voted for him then ?

So the business people who resigned from the group or are intending to must question the constitution and those who put his name forward as they would of known of his conviction and bankruptcies.Even before his cell has been cleaned, he's in the news.

For one member who said ' he knew nothing of his past.'Where has he been?

So much as i congratulate the Daily Echo for publishiing the story, i still feel there is a lot more to come out.
I totally agree the Echo needs to do more on this story for all the same reasons as political trainspotter states.
How secure is the voting system?
About as secure as the systems used by some Trade Unions and modern political postal voting when candidate's are fighting for electoral office in marginal seats probably, so NOT very!
[quote][p][bold]jinglebell[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]politicaltrainspotte r[/bold] wrote: From where i am sat are we being told the full story or am i being cynical ? He must have been nominated and seconded and a list of prospective candidates for the chair must of be circulated to members.So who voted for him then ? So the business people who resigned from the group or are intending to must question the constitution and those who put his name forward as they would of known of his conviction and bankruptcies.Even before his cell has been cleaned, he's in the news. For one member who said ' he knew nothing of his past.'Where has he been? So much as i congratulate the Daily Echo for publishiing the story, i still feel there is a lot more to come out.[/p][/quote]I totally agree the Echo needs to do more on this story for all the same reasons as political trainspotter states. How secure is the voting system?[/p][/quote]About as secure as the systems used by some Trade Unions and modern political postal voting when candidate's are fighting for electoral office in marginal seats probably, so NOT very! muscliffman
  • Score: 12

2:25pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Glashen says...

The-Bleeding-Obvious wrote:
The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.
Be sensible, many people who have bankruptcy in their history leave it behind and go on to great success but that isn't the issue here. Tony Ramsden is a three time bankrupt who has recently served a prison sentence for Fraud, The FSB is amongst other things a business advice provider, are you seriously suggesting he his a suitable person to chair the local branch.
[quote][p][bold]The-Bleeding-Obvious[/bold] wrote: The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.[/p][/quote]Be sensible, many people who have bankruptcy in their history leave it behind and go on to great success but that isn't the issue here. Tony Ramsden is a three time bankrupt who has recently served a prison sentence for Fraud, The FSB is amongst other things a business advice provider, are you seriously suggesting he his a suitable person to chair the local branch. Glashen
  • Score: 22

3:37pm Sat 15 Mar 14

RM says...

Congrats to the Echo on this 'scoop' & the outcome. However, as many other readers have commented, this is only the start of the story - who nominated him? Was any checking done to consider his suitability (or otherwise) for the post? How many other nominations were there? How many votes did he get - how many members voted - do all FSB members get a vote or only the Committee - did Daddy have any part in his nomination & election? Will the X'church Cllr who praised him be 'considering his future'? A very rich vein for investigation - go for it Echo.
Congrats to the Echo on this 'scoop' & the outcome. However, as many other readers have commented, this is only the start of the story - who nominated him? Was any checking done to consider his suitability (or otherwise) for the post? How many other nominations were there? How many votes did he get - how many members voted - do all FSB members get a vote or only the Committee - did Daddy have any part in his nomination & election? Will the X'church Cllr who praised him be 'considering his future'? A very rich vein for investigation - go for it Echo. RM
  • Score: 27

4:14pm Sat 15 Mar 14

HRH of Boscombe says...

Bankrupt THREE time and a convicted fraudster.
.
Everyone involved in his appointment need to resign for the FSB to regain it's credibility.
.
Who makes these kind of moronic decisions?
Bankrupt THREE time and a convicted fraudster. . Everyone involved in his appointment need to resign for the FSB to regain it's credibility. . Who makes these kind of moronic decisions? HRH of Boscombe
  • Score: 20

4:42pm Sat 15 Mar 14

whataboutthat says...

back under the rock Tony...
back under the rock Tony... whataboutthat
  • Score: 16

5:02pm Sat 15 Mar 14

skydriver says...

People power had him ousted, now we have to do the same for most of the councillors in our region !
People power had him ousted, now we have to do the same for most of the councillors in our region ! skydriver
  • Score: 13

5:10pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Bob49 says...

It should not be forgotten that the town's head of council (Beesley) was once in business with this chap - and when that business failed it was Ramsden who took the rap, even though they both owned an equal number of shares in that company. There were further allegations that Beesley failed to declare an interest during planning applications from Ramsden.

Whilst cynics might wonder if this was some kind of pay back for taking the rap over that bankruptcy, it must raise the question of how unacountable certain folk must feel they are that this appointment would go unchallenged.

There is certainly something rotten about parts of the council ....... and more so the flies that buzz around it.
It should not be forgotten that the town's head of council (Beesley) was once in business with this chap - and when that business failed it was Ramsden who took the rap, even though they both owned an equal number of shares in that company. There were further allegations that Beesley failed to declare an interest during planning applications from Ramsden. Whilst cynics might wonder if this was some kind of pay back for taking the rap over that bankruptcy, it must raise the question of how unacountable certain folk must feel they are that this appointment would go unchallenged. There is certainly something rotten about parts of the council ....... and more so the flies that buzz around it. Bob49
  • Score: 23

6:02pm Sat 15 Mar 14

jazzy jenkins says...

Good on you Echo..now try and sort out the Hengistbury Noddy train fiasco..some more corrupt goings on there I reckon.
Good on you Echo..now try and sort out the Hengistbury Noddy train fiasco..some more corrupt goings on there I reckon. jazzy jenkins
  • Score: 18

6:44pm Sat 15 Mar 14

iseestupidpeople says...

So has his dad, also a declared bankrupt, also resigned?? Who the hell voted that pair in? Surely they should leave too if they think it's ok to have 'people' like this working for them?
So has his dad, also a declared bankrupt, also resigned?? Who the hell voted that pair in? Surely they should leave too if they think it's ok to have 'people' like this working for them? iseestupidpeople
  • Score: 24

7:05pm Sat 15 Mar 14

calamity carney says...

The front of the man and the people who employed him in that position!
The front of the man and the people who employed him in that position! calamity carney
  • Score: 7

7:53pm Sat 15 Mar 14

The-Bleeding-Obvious says...

Glashen wrote:
The-Bleeding-Obvious wrote:
The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.
Be sensible, many people who have bankruptcy in their history leave it behind and go on to great success but that isn't the issue here. Tony Ramsden is a three time bankrupt who has recently served a prison sentence for Fraud, The FSB is amongst other things a business advice provider, are you seriously suggesting he his a suitable person to chair the local branch.
I'm suggesting that both he and the FSB should have realised that anyone with a criminal record, such an appointment would never be satisfactory.
[quote][p][bold]Glashen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The-Bleeding-Obvious[/bold] wrote: The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.[/p][/quote]Be sensible, many people who have bankruptcy in their history leave it behind and go on to great success but that isn't the issue here. Tony Ramsden is a three time bankrupt who has recently served a prison sentence for Fraud, The FSB is amongst other things a business advice provider, are you seriously suggesting he his a suitable person to chair the local branch.[/p][/quote]I'm suggesting that both he and the FSB should have realised that anyone with a criminal record, such an appointment would never be satisfactory. The-Bleeding-Obvious
  • Score: 10

10:00pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Bob49 says...

The problem is that certain folk have got away with so much (Boscombe sea front) that they have come to believe that they are untouchable and they can do anything - and they will continue to believe this until locals start to take action.

Sadly I wouldn't hold you breath on the later.
The problem is that certain folk have got away with so much (Boscombe sea front) that they have come to believe that they are untouchable and they can do anything - and they will continue to believe this until locals start to take action. Sadly I wouldn't hold you breath on the later. Bob49
  • Score: 12

10:06pm Sat 15 Mar 14

carrrob says...

Well done to the reporter on this story exactly how a local paper should operate
Well done to the reporter on this story exactly how a local paper should operate carrrob
  • Score: 13

10:38pm Sat 15 Mar 14

Yankee1 says...

So, will that Christchurch councilor who yesterday gave Tony a very public thumbs up resign?

No?

No surprise, then. No character, either.
So, will that Christchurch councilor who yesterday gave Tony a very public thumbs up resign? No? No surprise, then. No character, either. Yankee1
  • Score: 13

11:08pm Sat 15 Mar 14

BIGTONE says...

Ohhhhh Happeeeee. Day
Ohhhhh Happeeeee. Day BIGTONE
  • Score: 6

7:47am Sun 16 Mar 14

Lord Spring says...

iseestupidpeople wrote:
So has his dad, also a declared bankrupt, also resigned?? Who the hell voted that pair in? Surely they should leave too if they think it's ok to have 'people' like this working for them?
To stand for an election one has to be nominated that is where this whole issue stems from, the nominees should be exposed as well
Sounds like there are more than one bad apple in the barrel.

Talking of barrels whose turn next.
[quote][p][bold]iseestupidpeople[/bold] wrote: So has his dad, also a declared bankrupt, also resigned?? Who the hell voted that pair in? Surely they should leave too if they think it's ok to have 'people' like this working for them?[/p][/quote]To stand for an election one has to be nominated that is where this whole issue stems from, the nominees should be exposed as well Sounds like there are more than one bad apple in the barrel. Talking of barrels whose turn next. Lord Spring
  • Score: 11

8:28am Sun 16 Mar 14

Scouser4ever says...

I am cancelling my membership to the federation of small businesses on Monday morning they are corrupt & rotten through & through, these people need investigating , disgraceful people, why do we put up with this!!!
I am cancelling my membership to the federation of small businesses on Monday morning they are corrupt & rotten through & through, these people need investigating , disgraceful people, why do we put up with this!!! Scouser4ever
  • Score: 14

9:26am Sun 16 Mar 14

PoopScoop says...

The fact that Tony Ramsden had been "elected", the office of branch chairman of the FSB was actually first unearthed and given to The Echo by the local pressure group abetterbournemouth. http://abetterbourne
mouth.org
Now that the Echo knows where the bodies are buried they should keep digging.
The fact that Tony Ramsden had been "elected", the office of branch chairman of the FSB was actually first unearthed and given to The Echo by the local pressure group abetterbournemouth. http://abetterbourne mouth.org Now that the Echo knows where the bodies are buried they should keep digging. PoopScoop
  • Score: 14

9:31am Sun 16 Mar 14

RM says...

Yankee1 wrote:
So, will that Christchurch councilor who yesterday gave Tony a very public thumbs up resign?

No?

No surprise, then. No character, either.
Council elections next year when voters can have their say on Poole, Bournemouth & X'church Cllrs. However, no good sitting at home on the day going 'Oh it's not worth voting, they're all the same' or worse still, voting for Party X 'because my Dad always voted for them'. We get the Cllrs we deserve.
[quote][p][bold]Yankee1[/bold] wrote: So, will that Christchurch councilor who yesterday gave Tony a very public thumbs up resign? No? No surprise, then. No character, either.[/p][/quote]Council elections next year when voters can have their say on Poole, Bournemouth & X'church Cllrs. However, no good sitting at home on the day going 'Oh it's not worth voting, they're all the same' or worse still, voting for Party X 'because my Dad always voted for them'. We get the Cllrs we deserve. RM
  • Score: 12

9:45am Sun 16 Mar 14

pete woodley says...

Still not a word from the Chamber of Trade,are the Ramsdens members of that as well ?.Just how many other organisations were they involved in.
Still not a word from the Chamber of Trade,are the Ramsdens members of that as well ?.Just how many other organisations were they involved in. pete woodley
  • Score: 11

9:52am Sun 16 Mar 14

pete woodley says...

PoopScoop wrote:
The fact that Tony Ramsden had been "elected", the office of branch chairman of the FSB was actually first unearthed and given to The Echo by the local pressure group abetterbournemouth. http://abetterbourne

mouth.org
Now that the Echo knows where the bodies are buried they should keep digging.
Who are they,or is that a secret too ?.
[quote][p][bold]PoopScoop[/bold] wrote: The fact that Tony Ramsden had been "elected", the office of branch chairman of the FSB was actually first unearthed and given to The Echo by the local pressure group abetterbournemouth. http://abetterbourne mouth.org Now that the Echo knows where the bodies are buried they should keep digging.[/p][/quote]Who are they,or is that a secret too ?. pete woodley
  • Score: 6

1:48pm Sun 16 Mar 14

doncollier says...

Scouser4ever wrote:
I am cancelling my membership to the federation of small businesses on Monday morning they are corrupt & rotten through & through, these people need investigating , disgraceful people, why do we put up with this!!!
I'm not! I want to make sure the next person elected cleans it up and represents us. Join me in staying, paying attention to what is happening to OUR organisation and VOTING.

Sad to say to some extent we all dropped the ball on this!
[quote][p][bold]Scouser4ever[/bold] wrote: I am cancelling my membership to the federation of small businesses on Monday morning they are corrupt & rotten through & through, these people need investigating , disgraceful people, why do we put up with this!!![/p][/quote]I'm not! I want to make sure the next person elected cleans it up and represents us. Join me in staying, paying attention to what is happening to OUR organisation and VOTING. Sad to say to some extent we all dropped the ball on this! doncollier
  • Score: 6

9:23pm Sun 16 Mar 14

The-Bleeding-Obvious says...

The-Bleeding-Obvious wrote:
Glashen wrote:
The-Bleeding-Obvious wrote:
The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.
Be sensible, many people who have bankruptcy in their history leave it behind and go on to great success but that isn't the issue here. Tony Ramsden is a three time bankrupt who has recently served a prison sentence for Fraud, The FSB is amongst other things a business advice provider, are you seriously suggesting he his a suitable person to chair the local branch.
I'm suggesting that both he and the FSB should have realised that anyone with a criminal record, such an appointment would never be satisfactory.
I'm surprised you couldn't understand my original comment?
[quote][p][bold]The-Bleeding-Obvious[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Glashen[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The-Bleeding-Obvious[/bold] wrote: The underlying message here for Mr Ramsden must be, break the law and you never stop paying your debt to society. Surprised the FSB couldn't see it the same way.[/p][/quote]Be sensible, many people who have bankruptcy in their history leave it behind and go on to great success but that isn't the issue here. Tony Ramsden is a three time bankrupt who has recently served a prison sentence for Fraud, The FSB is amongst other things a business advice provider, are you seriously suggesting he his a suitable person to chair the local branch.[/p][/quote]I'm suggesting that both he and the FSB should have realised that anyone with a criminal record, such an appointment would never be satisfactory.[/p][/quote]I'm surprised you couldn't understand my original comment? The-Bleeding-Obvious
  • Score: 4

11:05pm Sun 16 Mar 14

Distressed of Dorset says...

It is now painfully obvious that the person behind this travesty, David Ramsden, ought to resign from both the Federation of Small Businesses and the Dorset Local Enterprise Partnership.

Will he however do the right thing and resign? It seems very unlikely. These are not people to whom "doing the right thing" means anything. They are users, takers, and connivers.
It is now painfully obvious that the person behind this travesty, David Ramsden, ought to resign from both the Federation of Small Businesses and the Dorset Local Enterprise Partnership. Will he however do the right thing and resign? It seems very unlikely. These are not people to whom "doing the right thing" means anything. They are users, takers, and connivers. Distressed of Dorset
  • Score: 12

8:32am Mon 17 Mar 14

BIGTONE says...

Former Poole councillor Don Collier, who has been a member of the FSB for many years, said he was among many members who had paid no attention to the election.


I wonder if you will ignore the local Council elections in the same way?
Phhhfffffftttttt.
Former Poole councillor Don Collier, who has been a member of the FSB for many years, said he was among many members who had paid no attention to the election. I wonder if you will ignore the local Council elections in the same way? Phhhfffffftttttt. BIGTONE
  • Score: 6

8:58am Mon 17 Mar 14

Marcus James says...

Shame the Echo have bowed to pressure from someone at the FSB and now removed their name from the headline??
Perhaps the Echo care more about advertising "Revenue" than naming and shaming???
Shame the Echo have bowed to pressure from someone at the FSB and now removed their name from the headline?? Perhaps the Echo care more about advertising "Revenue" than naming and shaming??? Marcus James
  • Score: 6

9:07am Mon 17 Mar 14

doncollier says...

BIGTONE wrote:
Former Poole councillor Don Collier, who has been a member of the FSB for many years, said he was among many members who had paid no attention to the election.


I wonder if you will ignore the local Council elections in the same way?
Phhhfffffftttttt.
I didn't say ignored it, I said I did not pay enough attention to it and like many of the FSB members locally I should have paid more attention than I did

I didn't say I didn't say I paid no attention. The fact is I am not even sure there was a vote and at this time can find no evidence that there was one. The fact that I didn't notice that either a no contest or the ballot if there was one is what I meant by not paying enough attention to it.

My point however remains that the responsibility for this lies with the members locally not with the national body.
[quote][p][bold]BIGTONE[/bold] wrote: Former Poole councillor Don Collier, who has been a member of the FSB for many years, said he was among many members who had paid no attention to the election. I wonder if you will ignore the local Council elections in the same way? Phhhfffffftttttt.[/p][/quote]I didn't say ignored it, I said I did not pay enough attention to it and like many of the FSB members locally I should have paid more attention than I did I didn't say I didn't say I paid no attention. The fact is I am not even sure there was a vote and at this time can find no evidence that there was one. The fact that I didn't notice that either a no contest or the ballot if there was one is what I meant by not paying enough attention to it. My point however remains that the responsibility for this lies with the members locally not with the national body. doncollier
  • Score: -7

9:38am Mon 17 Mar 14

John T says...

doncollier

If you, being a former Conservative Councillor, like Tony Ramsden, and hence, presumably democratically aware (cough), didn't even know there was a ballot, how can you implore other FSB members to 'Join me staying in, paying attention to what is happening to OUR organisation and VOTING.'

PS Perhaps, I should let you know, in case you have not noticed, that the Conservative Party has too vacant (sic) seats in your former Parkstone Ward!
doncollier If you, being a former Conservative Councillor, like Tony Ramsden, and hence, presumably democratically aware (cough), didn't even know there was a ballot, how can you implore other FSB members to 'Join me staying in, paying attention to what is happening to OUR organisation and VOTING.' PS Perhaps, I should let you know, in case you have not noticed, that the Conservative Party has too vacant (sic) seats in your former Parkstone Ward! John T
  • Score: 8

9:39am Mon 17 Mar 14

JimDorset says...

Yes - I still want the Echo to publish a list of all those who voted for Ramsden - I shall not want to do business with any of them: until we know who these knaves are all members of FSB are under suspicion.
Yes - I still want the Echo to publish a list of all those who voted for Ramsden - I shall not want to do business with any of them: until we know who these knaves are all members of FSB are under suspicion. JimDorset
  • Score: 6

10:41am Mon 17 Mar 14

doncollier says...

John T wrote:
doncollier

If you, being a former Conservative Councillor, like Tony Ramsden, and hence, presumably democratically aware (cough), didn't even know there was a ballot, how can you implore other FSB members to 'Join me staying in, paying attention to what is happening to OUR organisation and VOTING.'

PS Perhaps, I should let you know, in case you have not noticed, that the Conservative Party has too vacant (sic) seats in your former Parkstone Ward!
So now the politics and snide innuendoes and ad homonyms come out!

Lets stick with the facts. I did not say I didn't know there was a ballot, I have no record of receiving a ballot paper, entirely different. If there was no contest, which their might have been then I would not have received a ballot paper but I also don't recall receiving a notice of who the new chairman was or that there was no contest. It is always possible it wasn't sent out.

All of these things are questions I am asking the FSB nationally to investigate on our, members, behalf and I have absolute faith they will get to the bottom of it and deal with it.

As for your PS I presume you mean "two" not "too" and I am sure my former colleagues and the Conservatives in Parkstone will deal with any vacancies in a proper manner as they have always done.
[quote][p][bold]John T[/bold] wrote: doncollier If you, being a former Conservative Councillor, like Tony Ramsden, and hence, presumably democratically aware (cough), didn't even know there was a ballot, how can you implore other FSB members to 'Join me staying in, paying attention to what is happening to OUR organisation and VOTING.' PS Perhaps, I should let you know, in case you have not noticed, that the Conservative Party has too vacant (sic) seats in your former Parkstone Ward![/p][/quote]So now the politics and snide innuendoes and ad homonyms come out! Lets stick with the facts. I did not say I didn't know there was a ballot, I have no record of receiving a ballot paper, entirely different. If there was no contest, which their might have been then I would not have received a ballot paper but I also don't recall receiving a notice of who the new chairman was or that there was no contest. It is always possible it wasn't sent out. All of these things are questions I am asking the FSB nationally to investigate on our, members, behalf and I have absolute faith they will get to the bottom of it and deal with it. As for your PS I presume you mean "two" not "too" and I am sure my former colleagues and the Conservatives in Parkstone will deal with any vacancies in a proper manner as they have always done. doncollier
  • Score: -2

11:00am Mon 17 Mar 14

John T says...

doncollier
Re my earlier PS, it would be ''too'' much to claim a Freudian slip...their, there?
doncollier Re my earlier PS, it would be ''too'' much to claim a Freudian slip...their, there? John T
  • Score: 6

11:01am Mon 17 Mar 14

sherlock1969 says...

Daddy seems to be keeping his head down. This appointment must have been initiated by him surely? Question therefore is whether he too is fit to have access to the Dorset LEP chequebook and be representing small businesses after this debacle and his own prior bankruptcy? One for the FSB and Dorset County Council to seriously ponder. Position untenable?
Daddy seems to be keeping his head down. This appointment must have been initiated by him surely? Question therefore is whether he too is fit to have access to the Dorset LEP chequebook and be representing small businesses after this debacle and his own prior bankruptcy? One for the FSB and Dorset County Council to seriously ponder. Position untenable? sherlock1969
  • Score: 17

11:13am Mon 17 Mar 14

muscliffman says...

JimDorset wrote:
Yes - I still want the Echo to publish a list of all those who voted for Ramsden - I shall not want to do business with any of them: until we know who these knaves are all members of FSB are under suspicion.
Perhaps by default we already have this (extremely short) list, since some FSB members are apparently starting to query if a full and properly promoted members vote ever occurred.

Still a long way to go on this story, and in the 'irregular' circumstances being uncovered at the FSB a journalistic investigation into the Board and activities of the publicly funded Dorset Local Enterprise Partnership would seem to be an appropriate next stop for the Echo.
[quote][p][bold]JimDorset[/bold] wrote: Yes - I still want the Echo to publish a list of all those who voted for Ramsden - I shall not want to do business with any of them: until we know who these knaves are all members of FSB are under suspicion.[/p][/quote]Perhaps by default we already have this (extremely short) list, since some FSB members are apparently starting to query if a full and properly promoted members vote ever occurred. Still a long way to go on this story, and in the 'irregular' circumstances being uncovered at the FSB a journalistic investigation into the Board and activities of the publicly funded Dorset Local Enterprise Partnership would seem to be an appropriate next stop for the Echo. muscliffman
  • Score: 13

12:25pm Mon 17 Mar 14

In Absentia says...

As someone who is regularly very critical of the Echo, I have to give praise when it's due. Good work on this story.

We really ought to see the resignation of Mr Ramsden Snr next. Presumably he endorsed his son as a candidate for the post?
As someone who is regularly very critical of the Echo, I have to give praise when it's due. Good work on this story. We really ought to see the resignation of Mr Ramsden Snr next. Presumably he endorsed his son as a candidate for the post? In Absentia
  • Score: 10

1:09pm Mon 17 Mar 14

Distressed of Dorset says...

In Absentia wrote:
As someone who is regularly very critical of the Echo, I have to give praise when it's due. Good work on this story.

We really ought to see the resignation of Mr Ramsden Snr next. Presumably he endorsed his son as a candidate for the post?
Put it this way: since his release from prison, Tony Ramsden has been living with his father.

It's a pretty good guess that father and son had a conversation or two about the appointment before it was made.
[quote][p][bold]In Absentia[/bold] wrote: As someone who is regularly very critical of the Echo, I have to give praise when it's due. Good work on this story. We really ought to see the resignation of Mr Ramsden Snr next. Presumably he endorsed his son as a candidate for the post?[/p][/quote]Put it this way: since his release from prison, Tony Ramsden has been living with his father. It's a pretty good guess that father and son had a conversation or two about the appointment before it was made. Distressed of Dorset
  • Score: 12

1:42pm Mon 17 Mar 14

UrbanCrab says...

Bournemouth's murky underbelly being exposed.
Bournemouth's murky underbelly being exposed. UrbanCrab
  • Score: 6

6:09pm Mon 17 Mar 14

mytown1 says...

So what does Cllr Colin Jamieson of Christchurch Borough Council have to say now after his statement in the press on Mr Ramsden's appointment and now resignation?
So what does Cllr Colin Jamieson of Christchurch Borough Council have to say now after his statement in the press on Mr Ramsden's appointment and now resignation? mytown1
  • Score: 2

7:08pm Mon 17 Mar 14

pete woodley says...

mytown1 wrote:
So what does Cllr Colin Jamieson of Christchurch Borough Council have to say now after his statement in the press on Mr Ramsden's appointment and now resignation?
All pals together,is normal amongst most councillors.
[quote][p][bold]mytown1[/bold] wrote: So what does Cllr Colin Jamieson of Christchurch Borough Council have to say now after his statement in the press on Mr Ramsden's appointment and now resignation?[/p][/quote]All pals together,is normal amongst most councillors. pete woodley
  • Score: -1

9:51pm Mon 17 Mar 14

Wageslave says...

HRH of Boscombe wrote:
Bankrupt THREE time and a convicted fraudster.
.
Everyone involved in his appointment need to resign for the FSB to regain it's credibility.
.
Who makes these kind of moronic decisions?
Probably the same kind of people that made Tony Blair a peace envoy.
[quote][p][bold]HRH of Boscombe[/bold] wrote: Bankrupt THREE time and a convicted fraudster. . Everyone involved in his appointment need to resign for the FSB to regain it's credibility. . Who makes these kind of moronic decisions?[/p][/quote]Probably the same kind of people that made Tony Blair a peace envoy. Wageslave
  • Score: 1

11:07am Tue 18 Mar 14

jinglebell says...

Come on Echo don't let this drop! We need more investigation and answers.
How many ordinary FSB members knew about an election where Ramsden was voted in? 5 of my close friends in the local FSB had not been informed there was an election and therefore could not vote.
The questions remain:
1. How many ordinary members were informed of this election?
2. If any members knew, and voted, how were the votes counted and by whom?
3. What pressure did Tony Ramsden's father - David Ramsden, the Branch Secretary - bring to bear on the "election" process?
As for Don Collier's , (an ex-Councillor) comments to the Echo and basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members; he would be better to have kept his mouth shut. But no, he deems it all a "piece of silliness" where an officer "dropped the ball".
From his comments, one would imagine there are thousands of officers - instead of 6 - and Tony Ramsden somehow slithered in unbeknownst to the countless thousands with their heads in the sand.
Come on Echo don't let this drop! We need more investigation and answers. How many ordinary FSB members knew about an election where Ramsden was voted in? 5 of my close friends in the local FSB had not been informed there was an election and therefore could not vote. The questions remain: 1. How many ordinary members were informed of this election? 2. If any members knew, and voted, how were the votes counted and by whom? 3. What pressure did Tony Ramsden's father - David Ramsden, the Branch Secretary - bring to bear on the "election" process? As for Don Collier's , (an ex-Councillor) comments to the Echo and basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members; he would be better to have kept his mouth shut. But no, he deems it all a "piece of silliness" where an officer "dropped the ball". From his comments, one would imagine there are thousands of officers - instead of 6 - and Tony Ramsden somehow slithered in unbeknownst to the countless thousands with their heads in the sand. jinglebell
  • Score: 0

11:30am Tue 18 Mar 14

doncollier says...

jinglebell wrote:
Come on Echo don't let this drop! We need more investigation and answers.
How many ordinary FSB members knew about an election where Ramsden was voted in? 5 of my close friends in the local FSB had not been informed there was an election and therefore could not vote.
The questions remain:
1. How many ordinary members were informed of this election?
2. If any members knew, and voted, how were the votes counted and by whom?
3. What pressure did Tony Ramsden's father - David Ramsden, the Branch Secretary - bring to bear on the "election" process?
As for Don Collier's , (an ex-Councillor) comments to the Echo and basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members; he would be better to have kept his mouth shut. But no, he deems it all a "piece of silliness" where an officer "dropped the ball".
From his comments, one would imagine there are thousands of officers - instead of 6 - and Tony Ramsden somehow slithered in unbeknownst to the countless thousands with their heads in the sand.
Your comment that I am somehow "basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members" is so far off base it is hard for me to put into words politely how I feel about it. I like you and your friends knew nothing about it and was shocked by the revelation. I will however be clear about my actual motivation for doing it.

Firstly. The FSB is a fantastic organisation that does a tremendous amount of good to all locally and nationally by supporting small business like my own and yours. I highly value it as an organisation and the staff that work for it. I at no time suggested or intended a slight to any of them and find your suggestion to that effect offensive.

Secondly. It is a members organisation made up of volunteers. Volunteers from the very same small business that it benefits and it was/is the members that stand for election, vote or not. It is therefore ONLY the members (Us) that could have done something about this. Resigning membership is giving up on a valuable and productive organisation. An organisation I want to see recover from this and not suffer from it which is the primary reason I commented

Thirdly so I am an ex Councillor, so what, It has nothing to do with this circumstance. I have no relation ship with either Mr Ramsden other than a passing acquaintance and I certainly DO NOT think it was appropriate that he finished up in this job no matter how that happened. It was clear to me that it was and is damaging to the good name of the FSB and my other purpose for my comment was therfore to try to rally the membership to support this highly valuable organisation .
[quote][p][bold]jinglebell[/bold] wrote: Come on Echo don't let this drop! We need more investigation and answers. How many ordinary FSB members knew about an election where Ramsden was voted in? 5 of my close friends in the local FSB had not been informed there was an election and therefore could not vote. The questions remain: 1. How many ordinary members were informed of this election? 2. If any members knew, and voted, how were the votes counted and by whom? 3. What pressure did Tony Ramsden's father - David Ramsden, the Branch Secretary - bring to bear on the "election" process? As for Don Collier's , (an ex-Councillor) comments to the Echo and basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members; he would be better to have kept his mouth shut. But no, he deems it all a "piece of silliness" where an officer "dropped the ball". From his comments, one would imagine there are thousands of officers - instead of 6 - and Tony Ramsden somehow slithered in unbeknownst to the countless thousands with their heads in the sand.[/p][/quote]Your comment that I am somehow "basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members" is so far off base it is hard for me to put into words politely how I feel about it. I like you and your friends knew nothing about it and was shocked by the revelation. I will however be clear about my actual motivation for doing it. Firstly. The FSB is a fantastic organisation that does a tremendous amount of good to all locally and nationally by supporting small business like my own and yours. I highly value it as an organisation and the staff that work for it. I at no time suggested or intended a slight to any of them and find your suggestion to that effect offensive. Secondly. It is a members organisation made up of volunteers. Volunteers from the very same small business that it benefits and it was/is the members that stand for election, vote or not. It is therefore ONLY the members (Us) that could have done something about this. Resigning membership is giving up on a valuable and productive organisation. An organisation I want to see recover from this and not suffer from it which is the primary reason I commented Thirdly so I am an ex Councillor, so what, It has nothing to do with this circumstance. I have no relation ship with either Mr Ramsden other than a passing acquaintance and I certainly DO NOT think it was appropriate that he finished up in this job no matter how that happened. It was clear to me that it was and is damaging to the good name of the FSB and my other purpose for my comment was therfore to try to rally the membership to support this highly valuable organisation . doncollier
  • Score: 5

12:52pm Tue 18 Mar 14

jinglebell says...

doncollier wrote:
jinglebell wrote:
Come on Echo don't let this drop! We need more investigation and answers.
How many ordinary FSB members knew about an election where Ramsden was voted in? 5 of my close friends in the local FSB had not been informed there was an election and therefore could not vote.
The questions remain:
1. How many ordinary members were informed of this election?
2. If any members knew, and voted, how were the votes counted and by whom?
3. What pressure did Tony Ramsden's father - David Ramsden, the Branch Secretary - bring to bear on the "election" process?
As for Don Collier's , (an ex-Councillor) comments to the Echo and basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members; he would be better to have kept his mouth shut. But no, he deems it all a "piece of silliness" where an officer "dropped the ball".
From his comments, one would imagine there are thousands of officers - instead of 6 - and Tony Ramsden somehow slithered in unbeknownst to the countless thousands with their heads in the sand.
Your comment that I am somehow "basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members" is so far off base it is hard for me to put into words politely how I feel about it. I like you and your friends knew nothing about it and was shocked by the revelation. I will however be clear about my actual motivation for doing it.

Firstly. The FSB is a fantastic organisation that does a tremendous amount of good to all locally and nationally by supporting small business like my own and yours. I highly value it as an organisation and the staff that work for it. I at no time suggested or intended a slight to any of them and find your suggestion to that effect offensive.

Secondly. It is a members organisation made up of volunteers. Volunteers from the very same small business that it benefits and it was/is the members that stand for election, vote or not. It is therefore ONLY the members (Us) that could have done something about this. Resigning membership is giving up on a valuable and productive organisation. An organisation I want to see recover from this and not suffer from it which is the primary reason I commented

Thirdly so I am an ex Councillor, so what, It has nothing to do with this circumstance. I have no relation ship with either Mr Ramsden other than a passing acquaintance and I certainly DO NOT think it was appropriate that he finished up in this job no matter how that happened. It was clear to me that it was and is damaging to the good name of the FSB and my other purpose for my comment was therfore to try to rally the membership to support this highly valuable organisation .
You talk about volunteers but let's not forget the FSB is ultimately a business with profits last year of £3.3 million from a turnover of £27 million. In regard to you and what you had to say to the Echo about "silliness" and it being the members fault etc. I think your comments were ill judged.
I have not met one person who is a member of the FSB who knew anything about the election, so my concern is that there was NO election process whatsoever and if there was, I suspect ballots were provided to a select few and/or that the "count" was tampered with.
Also, it is inconceivable that David Ramsden, as Branch Secretary did not know his son had put his name forward. As Branch Secretary, David Ramsden's judgment and integrity, therefore, also comes into question as he was happy for his son to be considered and then elected.
If David Ramsden was a man with integrity, how could he allow his son - convicted of fraud - to put his name forward for consideration? I think the answer is clear.
David Ramsden should be removed from his position and a detailed investigation should be conducted into the system so this cannot happen again.
[quote][p][bold]doncollier[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]jinglebell[/bold] wrote: Come on Echo don't let this drop! We need more investigation and answers. How many ordinary FSB members knew about an election where Ramsden was voted in? 5 of my close friends in the local FSB had not been informed there was an election and therefore could not vote. The questions remain: 1. How many ordinary members were informed of this election? 2. If any members knew, and voted, how were the votes counted and by whom? 3. What pressure did Tony Ramsden's father - David Ramsden, the Branch Secretary - bring to bear on the "election" process? As for Don Collier's , (an ex-Councillor) comments to the Echo and basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members; he would be better to have kept his mouth shut. But no, he deems it all a "piece of silliness" where an officer "dropped the ball". From his comments, one would imagine there are thousands of officers - instead of 6 - and Tony Ramsden somehow slithered in unbeknownst to the countless thousands with their heads in the sand.[/p][/quote]Your comment that I am somehow "basically coming out to bat for the Ramsden clique and blaming members" is so far off base it is hard for me to put into words politely how I feel about it. I like you and your friends knew nothing about it and was shocked by the revelation. I will however be clear about my actual motivation for doing it. Firstly. The FSB is a fantastic organisation that does a tremendous amount of good to all locally and nationally by supporting small business like my own and yours. I highly value it as an organisation and the staff that work for it. I at no time suggested or intended a slight to any of them and find your suggestion to that effect offensive. Secondly. It is a members organisation made up of volunteers. Volunteers from the very same small business that it benefits and it was/is the members that stand for election, vote or not. It is therefore ONLY the members (Us) that could have done something about this. Resigning membership is giving up on a valuable and productive organisation. An organisation I want to see recover from this and not suffer from it which is the primary reason I commented Thirdly so I am an ex Councillor, so what, It has nothing to do with this circumstance. I have no relation ship with either Mr Ramsden other than a passing acquaintance and I certainly DO NOT think it was appropriate that he finished up in this job no matter how that happened. It was clear to me that it was and is damaging to the good name of the FSB and my other purpose for my comment was therfore to try to rally the membership to support this highly valuable organisation .[/p][/quote]You talk about volunteers but let's not forget the FSB is ultimately a business with profits last year of £3.3 million from a turnover of £27 million. In regard to you and what you had to say to the Echo about "silliness" and it being the members fault etc. I think your comments were ill judged. I have not met one person who is a member of the FSB who knew anything about the election, so my concern is that there was NO election process whatsoever and if there was, I suspect ballots were provided to a select few and/or that the "count" was tampered with. Also, it is inconceivable that David Ramsden, as Branch Secretary did not know his son had put his name forward. As Branch Secretary, David Ramsden's judgment and integrity, therefore, also comes into question as he was happy for his son to be considered and then elected. If David Ramsden was a man with integrity, how could he allow his son - convicted of fraud - to put his name forward for consideration? I think the answer is clear. David Ramsden should be removed from his position and a detailed investigation should be conducted into the system so this cannot happen again. jinglebell
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