Rectifying Boscombe's surf reef could cost more - and work would not start until April (From Bournemouth Echo)
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Rectifying Boscombe's surf reef could cost more - and work would not start until April
8:57am Wednesday 14th July 2010 in
THE £3 million bill for Boscombe’s controversial surf reef may rise even further if civic chiefs want the tourist attraction to become the surfing magnet they had envisaged, experts warned last night.
And work to rectify Europe’s first artificial surf reef’s failings is unlikely to get underway for another nine months, a special Town Hall scrutiny meeting was told.
Councillors had the opportunity to grill officers on why their expectations of the reef’s performance had been downgraded since the local authority agreed to pursue the creation of a |double-sided reef wrapped around Boscombe Pier back in 2000.
At the time a report by New Zealand based contractors ASR said a 2.0 to 2.2 times wave height enhancement was expected.
But five years later an initial design report said the company aimed to design a reef with a surfing difficulty of four to five. The ideal ride length would be between 75 and 100m and last between 12 and 15 seconds.
It was not until May this year that the council released results of the reef’s first monitoring exercise which showed it was failing to meet four out of its 11 objectives.
Last night the borough’s leisure services director Roger Brown admitted that “relatively little” had been known about the work of ASR.
He added: “It was a leap of faith, by the council, to say we wanted to try this technology in Bournemouth. At the time we went to contract we knew exactly what we were going to get in terms of structure and predicted outputs. We didn’t know that in 2005.
“There was always going to be a risk – that was made clear from the outset but a decision was taken and we, as officers, commissioned the reef.”
Mr Brown said the council was withholding a £150,000 performance-based payment to ASR until the reef was rectified, with work expected to get under way next April or May.
Peter Hebard, a coastal engineering expert, said: “Time is of the essence – get a list of defects and action plans. It might be an open question as to who pays.
“The reef’s reputation is of great value and it might be worth putting a little bit extra in to gain a lot. What is important is that the world has a positive view of the project which has enormous economic value.”
Brian Weight, former British Surfing Association chairman, agreed that more money might need to be spent on the reef.
He said: “I think the reef has great potential. Maybe £250,000 more will have to be spent to get five times the value. Maybe that would be worthwhile.”
But Cllr Michael Everingham said: “I don’t think we are going to have support from ratepayers to spend more money on a reef that is not working.”
The panel agreed to set up a cross-party panel to consider ASR’s new proposals along with representatives from the surfing community.
Comments(73)
oversixty
says...
9:12am Wed 14 Jul 10
Huey wrote:Roger Brown retires in October !
No more money to be wasted on this, please! Oh, and sack Roger Brown.
jobsworthwatch
says...
9:16am Wed 14 Jul 10
chris100
says...
9:20am Wed 14 Jul 10
The irate commuter
says...
9:23am Wed 14 Jul 10
oversixty wrote:Maybe Roger could donate his nice & hefty retirement fund to pay for the improvements ?
Huey wrote: No more money to be wasted on this, please! Oh, and sack Roger Brown.Roger Brown retires in October !
sollie
says...
9:25am Wed 14 Jul 10
benjamin
says...
9:30am Wed 14 Jul 10
volval
says...
10:14am Wed 14 Jul 10
lilliputian
says...
10:16am Wed 14 Jul 10
sergeheerik
says...
10:32am Wed 14 Jul 10
BmthNewshound
says...
10:34am Wed 14 Jul 10
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If Roger Brown was in any way responsible for making the decision to go ahead with the reef he should be sacked and loose his pension rights. The whole sorry story of Boscombe Surf Reef is probably well explained by another story in todays echo “Managers at Bournemouth Council don’t have the skills”, sums up Roger Brown and his colleagues perfectly.
Mediclogan5
says...
10:47am Wed 14 Jul 10
CTW wrote:An excellent idea CTW, but it shows that these councillors running our leisure services are grossly inept and out of touch, and even to suggest to spend more on this expensive failure is not only immoral given the cuts in local services but an insult to every tax payer in Bournemouth.
Everything Roger Brown has had the lead on, results in usually something going wrong, or is not completed, or is one big failure for the town. Firstly he should be removed from office before retirement.
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The Reef should be offered to the Oceanarium as a science field for the work they do on sea life around our coasts.
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No more of OUR money should be spent on the Reef. ASR are not bothered about the £150k, they have already had £3.6m. The left over money should be spent on adding something to the lump of concrete jutting out from the front, oh yes, Boscombe Pier.
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Finally, this is a good start for Peter Charon, in using his new position (subject to the 19th July) to stop more money being poured into a wasted contract..
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Lets hope more of Mr. Brown's projects come to failure as well.
busguy
says...
10:48am Wed 14 Jul 10
seniorman
says...
11:09am Wed 14 Jul 10
golden mouldie
says...
11:12am Wed 14 Jul 10
reefwatching
says...
11:15am Wed 14 Jul 10
nobull
says...
11:26am Wed 14 Jul 10
and give us relief from all that noise!
Corrupto
says...
11:28am Wed 14 Jul 10
oversixty wrote:and gets a massive pay off/pension to reward the failure? nice 'work' if you can get it.
Huey wrote:Roger Brown retires in October !
No more money to be wasted on this, please! Oh, and sack Roger Brown.
“The reef’s reputation is of great value and it might be worth putting a little bit extra in to gain a lot. What is important is that the world has a positive view of the project which has enormous economic value.”
Is this possibly the most ludicrous quote ever published in the Echo?
Bob49
says...
11:45am Wed 14 Jul 10
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And there would have been no building of the Moneycombe flats. It was in no ones interest to look too closely at the reef. It was in quite a few people's interest to ensure the flats were built though.
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The ratepayers are left will a pile of submerged sandbags, another heap this time of undelivered promises and a hefty £3m plus bill for the overspend. Those in the know are left with a healthy profit.
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Think it won't happen again ? Think the public will be wise to it ? Then think again and watch the fools get taken in by the next land grab at Kings Park.
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A few smarmy words, a bucketful of promises and yet another bit of our heritage is robbed from us and future generations.
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Trebles all round, old boy !
Redgolfer
says...
12:00pm Wed 14 Jul 10
simonhumby
says...
12:02pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Let reef remain an albatross around your necks - like the council are around ours.
People, please - if you want competent, trustworthy councillors don't make the choice based on their party ticket. It's irresponsible, anti-social and lazy
Corrupto
says...
12:02pm Wed 14 Jul 10
contric
says...
12:22pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Adrian Fudge
says...
12:52pm Wed 14 Jul 10
They justified the leap in cost because they had got a better deal but now it transpires that all that has happened is a greater sum of money has been wasted
reefwatching
says...
12:54pm Wed 14 Jul 10
busguy
says...
1:13pm Wed 14 Jul 10
reefwatching wrote:Would it actually be worth the massive legal costs, and the time it takes legal people to get a result! A current long awaited 'investigation' result springs to mind!
you have almost got to feel sorry for Roger. Either he pays ASR the £150k, opening himself up to even more riducle as it is plain to anyone it does not work as promised, or he withholds the £150k, supposedly saving the council money, but essentially admitting that he has wasted the other £3.5m! Bet he can't wait till he retires, dare I say there might be a few delaying tactics going on leaving his successor to pick up the pieces?? One day this will end up in court with BBC trying to claw back money from ASR, the sooner they accept this and get on with it the better.
I like the Vulcan bomb idea................
The irate commuter
says...
2:01pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Jujuby
says...
2:41pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Sorry, but it seems a little late for that. I'm not a surfer so can't give an opinion however I live very close to Boscombe Pier thus spend a fair bit of time in the vicinity and also frequently catch the buses that stop at the Pier during the summer. I have overheard so many comments from visitors, apparently from visitors to Bournemouth, searching for the reef, asking "where is it then?", and generally having a laugh. Anectdotal I know, but it does seem as if it is has turned into a bit of a joke.
On the up side, can't say how much I love the atmosphere along that stretch of the beach and the improvements in the area generally in recent years. Wonderful!
Gastines
says...
2:42pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Capt. Ahab (ret.)
says...
3:11pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Tis with right sadness that I read the Brethren maybe asked to pay more gold coins?? May I ask why!! They aint got what they ALREADY paid fer, allow me to concentrate me mind……… Brethren be a paying more fer getting less. Weights Elephant be decomposing now, next spring all the Boscombe sand would’ve washed up in New Zealand. And as fer yer quote “It was not until May this year that the council released results of the reef’s first monitoring exercise which showed it was failing to meet four out of its 11 objectives” may I remind thee……….
Do you agree with surf reef's four out of 10 score?
8:43am Tuesday 18th May 2010
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· Comments(12)
THE Plymouth University expert assessing the Boscombe Surf Reef has given it a ‘4/10’ rating and we asked people at Boscombe seafront yesterday for their views.
P.S. so the assessment was finally 4 aspects were accepted out of 11 not as ye do state in 14th Jul article.
Bob49
says...
3:39pm Wed 14 Jul 10
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Tata's good news, so perhaps you could help pay the £3m (so far) that will have to be found to make up the over spend.
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And then take another long hard look and ask yourself if what you see was worth £12m - bearing in mind that the shop and cafe WERE NOT paid for by that £12m.
a.g.o.g.
says...
4:03pm Wed 14 Jul 10
H2oHara
says...
4:03pm Wed 14 Jul 10
djd
says...
4:17pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Let them have their reef back and they can give us back the money.
midon
says...
4:30pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Do not waste any more money, unless it is paid for by sacking a dozen council employees, or council members.
atticus finch
says...
4:54pm Wed 14 Jul 10
I thought originally it was the latter but recent articles in The Echo report the former
boracay
says...
4:56pm Wed 14 Jul 10
boracay
says...
5:11pm Wed 14 Jul 10
EGHH
says...
5:24pm Wed 14 Jul 10
reefwatching
says...
5:48pm Wed 14 Jul 10
Xchurch-man
says...
6:13pm Wed 14 Jul 10
No more wasted cash on this useless white elephant.
contric
says...
7:07pm Wed 14 Jul 10
time nor Tide
says...
7:08pm Wed 14 Jul 10
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Should not the words "supposed to " be inserted instead of "has" for enormous value.?
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It might have if there were real indicators that it could have? (track record in its and others overall history)
booger
says...
10:27pm Wed 14 Jul 10
midon wrote:Are you still living in the sixties? Most surfers now have jobs, not all of us sleep in vans, not all of us smoke dope and say 'dude' a lot and yes, it's now safe to unlock your daughters from the bedroom..
The entire concept was thought up by "nutters". Making Boscombe the surfing capital of the U.K. was a non-starter. Surfers don't have large amounts of money to spend. They sleep in vans and to expect wonerful things to happen at Boscombe, because of a pile of sand bags dropped in the sea is nonsense. !!
Do not waste any more money, unless it is paid for by sacking a dozen council employees, or council members.
rainbowkisses
says...
8:23am Thu 15 Jul 10
busguy
says...
8:45am Thu 15 Jul 10
rainbowkisses wrote:I agree!
This is going to be interesting for Mr Charon. He only has to read the posts on here to see how the tax payers of \bournemouth feel about this sandbag. How is he going totell us on one hand that the Council will spend even more money on this waste of space, and then, on the other hand, about the cuts in frontline services, job loses etc because of money constraints. Even the "experts" don't really know how much extra money is needed, or even if it will work. Write it off and make sure the whole world knows just how useless ASR really are. The reef if a total flop, and no amount of spin is going to change that. This is OUR money you are playing with, not yours. Of course the businesses that are linked to the reef will be screaming for it to be finished, but that is just in their self interest, not the interest of the bulk of Bournemouth tax payers who will never use this reef. Enough is enough Mr Charon. Now we will see if you just talk the talk.
This debacle needs a line drawing under it once and for all. Stop wasting members and senior staff's time on it.
It is time to get back to what are the Council's core legal obligations to provide certain support and services to the taxpayers and ditch all the 'nice to haves'.
The core services should all be provided to higher than national average standard as a basic measure of 'value for money' for the taxpayer, with a target to be in the top 10% within two years. Any other work or services to only be provided on it's proven merits, not spurious reports based on supplied information, as per the reef!
time nor Tide
says...
9:01am Thu 15 Jul 10
/news/uk-england-106
33474
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shows a dismaying picture of sandbags that have little resemblance to any form of order. When compared with the diagrams on this next link
.
http://news.bbc.co.u
k/2/hi/uk_news/engla
nd/dorset/8688693.st
m
.
one wonders if its the same thing at all? Something has gone terribly wrong between the plans as shown on the second link and the bulging bumps with huge gaps in between on the first link.
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how can anyone have any faith in the person/persons responsible for the debacle depicted in the BBC photograph I just dont know?
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I also think that anyone seeing these pictures would also have the same total loss of confidence.
PeterCharon
says...
10:10am Thu 15 Jul 10
Peter
Cllr Peter Charon
Corrupto
says...
10:25am Thu 15 Jul 10
PeterCharon wrote:Dear Peter,
Good morning. I see that I am being challenged to respond - and we all know what a minefield this is...so I will need to tread very carefully indeed! It wasn't long ago that I was quoted in the Echo as saying "there ain't no more cash". Not very pretty gramatically, but I think everyone understood where I was coming from. We have £150,000 that we retained - thank goodness and my clearest steer will be that if we can improve the performance of the reef within that amount of money, that I think would make sense. The problem will arise if we are told that we can't. What Cllr Filer's Panel achieved on Tuesday (I was one of the Members on it) was to call for the formation of a group of people, inside and outside the Council, 1 Member from each of the 4 political groups, officers, experts and people representing the local trades and the surfing community. The terms of reference of the Task and Finish Group will be - to develop a technical solution to the surf reef performance which is fit for purpose,and to ensure that the financial arrangements to implement this solution are in the best interests of the Council and of course our Council Tax Payers. I hope it will meet on or before August 10. I shall be watching their deliberations like a hawk. When their recommendations come back to the Panel and then on to Cabinet, with very solid evidence one way or another, we can then make an informed decision. Please allow me and my new team the space and time to try to get to the best result for all of you, our residents and our tourist industry. Thanks and kind regards,
Peter
Cllr Peter Charon
Could you please explain why Barrett Homes could breach planning permission and get away with building extra floors ruining the view even more?
When if a local taxpayer attempted such a thing we would be forced to knock it down?
Surely this is not legal and also makes a mockery of consultation and makes the project specification a lie to the people of the town ?
open mind
says...
10:34am Thu 15 Jul 10
time nor Tide
says...
10:50am Thu 15 Jul 10
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If a promenade were described as detailed clear plans as the reef plans are , only then it were built to look as it had a triple dose of every mega-pox possible -who should pay for it to be cured?
Also look up the meaning of a shill on wikipedia!
marjorie01
says...
11:28am Thu 15 Jul 10
Could you please explain why Barrett Homes could breach planning permission and get away with building extra floors ruining the view even more?
I too would like to know and especially as Cllr Beesley was head of planning at the time -
reefwatching
says...
12:53pm Thu 15 Jul 10
time nor Tide
says...
1:05pm Thu 15 Jul 10
To have accredited practictioners act independantly to examine and report could prove to be a tad embarrassing to all that are party to this little charade of due process?
Glashen
says...
1:53pm Thu 15 Jul 10
marjorie01 wrote:It should be quite easy to produce the evidence of this alleged infringement and then take the council to the local government ombudsman for maladministration, if there as in fact been a breach of planning regulations.
Corrupto, Boscombe says...Dear Peter,
Could you please explain why Barrett Homes could breach planning permission and get away with building extra floors ruining the view even more?
I too would like to know and especially as Cllr Beesley was head of planning at the time -
PeterCharon
says...
2:27pm Thu 15 Jul 10
Hope that puts your minds at rest....for now!
Regards, Peter
Cllr Peter Charon
Gary Sherborne
says...
3:28pm Thu 15 Jul 10
Bob49
says...
4:49pm Thu 15 Jul 10
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Oddly enough it did not contain anything that was libellous, false,derogatory, offensive or threatening.
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It did contain a quote from the above article.
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The quote was made by the same council officer whose other quotes are repeatedly been taken down. Hardly much in the way of local democracy if a council officer cannot be held accountable for something THEY have said - and something that has been published in the public domain.
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Corrupto
says...
7:39pm Thu 15 Jul 10
Lets hope the Echo has the gusto to take this question up, or will it have to be left to the Nationals to do.
It does makes one wonder whether Mr Beesley will be living the high life on his retirement.
simonhumby
says...
7:51pm Thu 15 Jul 10
1. The ASR boss said that "as far as he was aware the Boscome reef was a great success" - has he threatened legal action to recover £150K?
2. Did the council hand over another cheque to the ASR boss last time he was here? If so how much of that £150K (if any) is still left to pay?
time nor Tide
says...
10:20pm Thu 15 Jul 10
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how anyone could look at the BBC pictures listed in my previous post and claim any semblance of success total escapes me.
Any tradesman will tell you that its nowhere near the manner of professionalism that each tradesman should demonstrate in work in progress or a completed job.
I'm totally appalled when i see an international BBC report of what was paid for in good faith. That only reflects on the payer as guillible and taken for a ride.
The looking I have done has confirmed that waves shape in the smoothness of the bottom they "feel" and that is demonstated by ASR's florida reef design and their Manganui reef model in their design. So is it any wonder that the reef wave reflects the dogs breakfast that the boss says is a "huge sucess". Its huge but its a huge "sucks" ess.
More looking reveals that it seems par for the course in that it sucks?
frankus
says...
11:45pm Thu 15 Jul 10
of course if you dont want to get rid of your polluting truck tyres etc, in this way which would last, a long time, before it breaks down into something fish would like to live in then **** ya. keep traveling all the way to cornwall, after i retire in 8 years would have been 7 but hey ho, Im going to B**** anyway
of course you need waves to arrive the way to do this is to have a deep channel out to sea that gradually funnels them in to the take off point with rounded walls you get too much chop if walls arent rounded but you do get height bounce like in Ireaga harbour wall break n santander, spain.
what you could have is series of blow up sections in front of the tyre wall thingy that you could blow up small sections of at a time you could then buy a card with your preselected program on and it would give you a variety of different waves to try out so you would get say 15 -20 waves before having to paddle to the pay booth again. of course nothing like the real thing without the occasional shark and killer whale for company... ugh! shudder... perhaps they could just simulate these - hey? theyll be serving pina coladas with an umbrella soon..
PeterCharon
says...
6:05am Fri 16 Jul 10
1. No.
2. No.
3. All of it.
Regards,
Peter
Cllr Peter Charon
time nor Tide
says...
10:17am Fri 16 Jul 10
Dear Peter,
You are to be congratulated for your effort in engaging with those having an interest in this issue.
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I hope that "being in touch" with the way it is, helps Council and the Town achieve the best that it can.
I admire your effort,
best wishes
TnT
PeterCharon
says...
1:00pm Fri 16 Jul 10
Cllr Peter Charon
the-devils-advocate
says...
3:23pm Fri 16 Jul 10
When is someone in local government going to show some leadership and scrap the whole thing?
It's whole raison d'être is flawed... think about it...
Surfing = long-haired beach bums with no jobs just moving here for an extended summer holiday to claim their dole while they splash around at local taxpayer's expense.
Surfers with means wouldn't give Bournemouth a second look anyway.
So rather than attract money to the area it will just cost us more as surfers OD on a diet of raw sewage!
Corrupto
says...
3:32pm Fri 16 Jul 10
PeterCharon wrote:Thanks for your reply.
Good afternoon. Thank you TnT. I'll do my very best to keep you all informed as matters unfold. Mr. Corrupto - I have been informed today by the Head of Planning and Transport that a thorough investigation has been carried out - I am waiting for the date etc - into the concerns you and others have raised about the height of the building. I am assured that Barratts did not breach the planning consent that they obtained. If I can publish the full report on the Council's website I will do so and let you know when it has been done. At least it saves you any more effort but thank you for bringing it to my attention. Kind regards, Peter
Cllr Peter Charon
Capt. Ahab (ret.)
says...
4:31pm Fri 16 Jul 10
Go on yer holidays, get yer breath back from the exhilaration ye have had being elected to a very ‘testing’ position, enjoy thy break, desist fer trying to please all at the drop of yer hat, calm yer exuberance to post several comments a day, return with a positive yearning to listen to yer Brethren VIA ward Cllrs attempt (hopefully succeed) to return credibility to thy WHOLE council, if ye don’t analyse thy real concerns than ye will be ejected next election quicker than a bucket of slops over me gunnels.
Regards, Ahab.
PeterCharon
says...
7:14pm Sat 17 Jul 10
time nor Tide
says...
7:38am Sun 18 Jul 10
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I do believe we may have some clear thinking from the top at last?
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Who else can remember John Major engaging directly with the people everywhere ? (1992)
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T'is a good example to follow if indeed there is true follow through?
Capt. Ahab (ret.)
says...
4:39pm Mon 19 Jul 10
PeterCharon wrote:Ahoy Mr Charon,
Ahoy there Skipper! Good advice which shall be heeded! It's only that by the time the crew called me on deck, the ship was headed for the rocks. 30 degrees astern, and then steady as she goes!Rgds. Peter
Tis right pleased I be ye did respond, you have me heartiest sympathy upon inheriting such a dismally led crew, not only do they appear to have cost many a hard earned Brethrens gold coin be ineffectually spent but have lost MY crews belief that they be capable of rectifying such impotency. Ye should encounter less ‘storms in a teacup’ (yer previous leaders anecdote) ahead if yer new ‘cabinet?’ be of same dutiful respect of their elected responsibilities in spite of a £3m(barrier) attempt to create ‘swell = waves = surf!! Or dare I say choppy waters ahead’
Regards, Ahab.
Capt. Ahab (ret.)
says...
4:41pm Mon 19 Jul 10
time nor Tide wrote:Ahoy ‘time nor Tide’ As always ye do make valid points, perhaps Mr Charon be disposed to avail himself of such upright Brethrens advice as ye and others do offer, finally a listening ‘leader’ in the true sense. That be, if as ye say, he do steer the course he promises, not be a working off two charts and his compass be true.
By yer leave capn,
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I do believe we may have some clear thinking from the top at last?
.
Who else can remember John Major engaging directly with the people everywhere ? (1992)
.
T'is a good example to follow if indeed there is true follow through?
The Sly Surfer
says...
10:45am Wed 4 Aug 10
Not being a local I have enjoyed surfing and now bodyboarding the Boscombe and Bournemoth areas for over 15yrs, and have always liked the atmosphere in the water, which is generally a lot more pleasent than some of the West Country 'Local' spots.
Being from up the South Coast we are well aware that surfing along the South is always a hit and miss affair with conditions having to be spot on to even resemble an average day in Cornwall.
So there was a great excitement when a 'surf-reef' was announced.
Why has it come to this then that it is such a failure...could you not see this coming? It was very plain to everyone looking in that it was a waste of money and effort....especially for the tax payers of Bournemouth.
If it ain't broke don't fix it!....we perhaps get 20 good days a year on the South Coast, 20 really good 'that was an awsome (surf) session' days, where you come out of the water feeling like it's been worth it, and most of them you have to chip the ice off of your wetsuit afterwards!
This isn't California or the Gold Coast, this isn't even Fistral Beach...and that is not always working! SO why did anyone think that stinking some inflatable bags under the water would make this the surfing mecca of the UK?
£3m would have gone a long way toward providing free access changing for surfers on the beach, some decent freshwater showers and a lot more facilites that water users really want.
From a water user perspective the overall effect has been that there are a lot more peolple in the water who do not know water ettiquette and crowding what was once a good beach break...
Eventually people will tire of this 'reef' and it will long term start having a detremental effect on the amount of people coming to the area to surf. Yeah it will be fine all the time you can keep the hype going, but without long term prospects it will fade away.
The council should be looking at retaining some of the trafic that passes through now and improve the facilities we can all use such as somewhere in the winter thats open after a cold session to even get a hot drink on the front! (and not from a gastro pub/cafe, somewhere you can go with a wetsuit on!!)
I have laid myself open to a lot of comments because it's just an outsiders view, but as a water user, the reef has had a negative effect for many people on what was a good, if somewhat sporadic, shore break....but wasn't that half the fun?
More Surf Reef stories
- Researchers look into value of £3m Boscombe surf reef
- Boscombe surf reef: Marine firms claim ASR owes them £60,000
- Sub-contractor wins county court judgement against ASR
- Boat strike at surf reef is no longer ‘clear cut’
- £150,000 in reserve cash being spent on surf reef
- ASR to come back in 2012 to improve surf reef
- Handling of surf reef not been our 'finest hour'
- Future of Boscombe surf reef hangs in balance
- Weather delays surf reef repairs
- Work begins on Boscombe Surf Reef
Picture: Gary Elson, Bournemouth Helicopters
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Huey says...
9:09am Wed 14 Jul 10
Oh, and sack Roger Brown.