Fears Bournemouth could become a target for travellers as the only place in area without a transit site

Fears Bournemouth could become a target for travellers as the only place in area without a transit site

Travellers at Pelhams Park Leisure Centre

The proposed site at Creekmoor

First published in News
Last updated
by

BOURNEMOUTH could become a target for travellers this summer as the only area without an official transit site, it is feared.

If Dorset and Poole both have a site ready for this summer, Bournemouth will be the only place where police will not be able to use enforcement powers against illegal encampments.

There are hopes Bournemouth will eventually be able to share a site with either Poole or Dorset but at the moment the law states that enforcement powers “can only be used where vacant pitches on a traveller site are available within the same local authority area.”

Bournemouth Council leader John Beesley has ruled out the possibility of finding a suitable site within the borough.

Cllr Phil Eades, Mayor of Poole, said: “I honestly believe that if Poole complies with the legislation, travellers will stop coming here.

“They will go somewhere that hasn’t complied – like Bournemouth. The travellers know the law.”

Bournemouth Council leader Cllr John Beesley said it was “disappointing” that the government had not yet cchanged the law to allow Bournemouth to use sites in neighbouring council areas.

But he said they stood by their position that they did not have any acceptable sites.

“The record in Bournemouth has been very robust in making sure that we protect our car parks and open spaces as vigorously as we possibly can.

“We have very good intelligence on possible unauthorised encampments and if one occurs, council officers move swiftly to take the necessary legal action to move them on as soon as possible.”

Bournemouth West MP Conor Burns, above, said: “The fact that Bournemouth hasn’t got provision does mean that police won’t have the powers to move travellers on.

“However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp. “It leaves us in a disadvantaged position but then again we’ve done all the feasibility studies and none of the sites had any degree of public support.”

 

First application for Poole site is submitted

THE first planning application has been submitted for a controversial temporary stopping place for travellers at Creekmoor, Poole.

However, instead of going for the whole site at Marshes End, which can accommodate 27 pitches, the application is only for a part of it which will provide 12 pitches for travelling families and vehicles.

Borough of Poole says this is to “achieve delivery of the scheme this summer” at Safety Drive, next to the fire station.

And a second application for a site with four pitches off Broad-stone Way, north of the B&Q car park, has yet to be submitted.

Residents are invited to comment on the proposal and the application is likely to be considered by the council’s planning committee on March 20.

There will be a display of the application at Creekmoor Library on February 13 and 14 between 10am and 4.30pm and on the 15th from 10am to 1pm.

“We are aware of concerns raised by local residents and would encourage everyone to come along to the drop-in sessions and see for themselves the proposals, and submit any comments about the planning application to the planning department,” said Peter Haikin, regulatory services manager, Borough of Poole. The three Creekmoor councillors opposed the plans at cabinet and full council and residents have raised worries with them about being able to have their say.

“Residents will be attending as objectors to address the planning committee,” said Cllr Judy Butt.

“However, they have raised their concern that under the planning committee constitution all objectors only have four minutes to collectively speak, which they feel is not long enough to explain all the issues in such a publicly important application.”

The full application – APP/ 14/00123/F – can be viewed online at boroughofpoole.com If approved, the site would operate between Good Friday and September 14 and travellers would not be directed to it after September 1.

A residents’ meeting is due to be held at Creekmoor Community Centre on March 1, at 5pm to which MP Robert Syms, Police and Crime Commissioner Martyn Underhill and a representative of Dorset Police have been invited.

 

• POLICE and Crime Commissioner Martyn Underhill, pictured, is backing Poole council’s moves to establish temporary transit sites for travellers this summer.

He has spoken in favour of planning applications for sites at Marshes End, Creekmoor and on land north of the B&Q car park at Broadstone Way.

And he said a similar site set up by Dorset County Council in advance of the Dorset Steam Fair last year proved to be a success.

This year, Dorset County Council will seek planning permission for a five-year, temporary site at Piddlehinton.

Mr Underhill has now pledged to attend planning application hearings in both Poole and Dorset to voice his support for establishing the sites.

He said: “Without an appropriate site to move unauthorised camps on to, the police are acting with one arm tied behind their backs.

“Unless an alternative site exists the police cannot use their powers to move the travellers on.

“The traveller issue has become like Groundhog Day – every year they have nowhere to go so move to unauthorised sites.

“I will support any local authority that is trying to find a way to end last year’s stand-off and, along the way, increase police powers to deal with any unauthorised sites.”

Comments (105)

Please log in to enable comment sorting

7:04am Tue 4 Feb 14

alasdair1967 says...

It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak,
How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs
To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost
Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard
It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak, How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard alasdair1967
  • Score: 14

7:05am Tue 4 Feb 14

Bonjovigirl says...

No we do not want a travellers camp in Bournemouth, it's bad enough every summer seeing them in king's park and other places leaving a mess behind and letting their dogs and kids run riot !!!!!!
No we do not want a travellers camp in Bournemouth, it's bad enough every summer seeing them in king's park and other places leaving a mess behind and letting their dogs and kids run riot !!!!!! Bonjovigirl
  • Score: 34

7:14am Tue 4 Feb 14

wonderway says...

plenty of room on land next to Welcome to Bournemouth sewage works
best place for them

they can enjoy the same odour they leave behind at parks, fields and car parks across the local area
plenty of room on land next to Welcome to Bournemouth sewage works best place for them they can enjoy the same odour they leave behind at parks, fields and car parks across the local area wonderway
  • Score: 62

7:23am Tue 4 Feb 14

Baysider says...

alasdair1967 wrote:
It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak,
How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs
To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost
Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard
Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.
[quote][p][bold]alasdair1967[/bold] wrote: It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak, How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard[/p][/quote]Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site. Baysider
  • Score: -2

7:26am Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -91

7:36am Tue 4 Feb 14

alasdair1967 says...

Baysider wrote:
alasdair1967 wrote:
It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak,
How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs
To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost
Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard
Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.
About time the laws where changed then
[quote][p][bold]Baysider[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]alasdair1967[/bold] wrote: It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak, How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard[/p][/quote]Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.[/p][/quote]About time the laws where changed then alasdair1967
  • Score: 20

7:40am Tue 4 Feb 14

Poole Pirate says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
And exactly what idealistic planet are you from ?. If I come and cr@p on your doorstep, leave all my rubbish in your garden and rip-off your elderly neighbour and tell you that it's the 'nomadic-way', you'll be OK with that will you ? - I don't think so.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]And exactly what idealistic planet are you from ?. If I come and cr@p on your doorstep, leave all my rubbish in your garden and rip-off your elderly neighbour and tell you that it's the 'nomadic-way', you'll be OK with that will you ? - I don't think so. Poole Pirate
  • Score: 90

7:51am Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
Any spare room in your church yard ?
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]Any spare room in your church yard ? kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 48

7:54am Tue 4 Feb 14

Derf says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
There are more than enough of these across Dorset, many of them managed and very well serviced by the Caravan club.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]There are more than enough of these across Dorset, many of them managed and very well serviced by the Caravan club. Derf
  • Score: 35

7:57am Tue 4 Feb 14

TheDistrict says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
What a pathetic comment, and to use the Nazi scenario to get a message across. We are not Nazis, which had no regard for anyone but themselves. On the matter of traveller sites, the vast majority have indicated they do not want them in Bournemouth, such as Madeira Road, Muscliff, etc, but are happy with in reason to have them located at such locations as Canford Arena, Matchams and such spaces, away from the town, and away from built up areas. At the same time, true residents of Bournemouth and indeed Poole what assurity that travellers will be responsible for their own waste, and forced to remove before moving on. As stated not only in this story but many before on this subject, the large majority of travellers arrive before the Steam Rally, therefore giving them a large area to park up prior to the show, is a better option, rather than having small pockets parked in many car parks, parks, and open space areas designed for the public use. The owner of the fields for the Steam Rally should open his gates 3 months before the fair so that the travellers can park up and stay out of the way of the people of Bournemouth and Poole.

A man of God, surely must think more of his greater flock than a few travellers that are only passing through to the fair.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]What a pathetic comment, and to use the Nazi scenario to get a message across. We are not Nazis, which had no regard for anyone but themselves. On the matter of traveller sites, the vast majority have indicated they do not want them in Bournemouth, such as Madeira Road, Muscliff, etc, but are happy with in reason to have them located at such locations as Canford Arena, Matchams and such spaces, away from the town, and away from built up areas. At the same time, true residents of Bournemouth and indeed Poole what assurity that travellers will be responsible for their own waste, and forced to remove before moving on. As stated not only in this story but many before on this subject, the large majority of travellers arrive before the Steam Rally, therefore giving them a large area to park up prior to the show, is a better option, rather than having small pockets parked in many car parks, parks, and open space areas designed for the public use. The owner of the fields for the Steam Rally should open his gates 3 months before the fair so that the travellers can park up and stay out of the way of the people of Bournemouth and Poole. A man of God, surely must think more of his greater flock than a few travellers that are only passing through to the fair. TheDistrict
  • Score: 36

8:05am Tue 4 Feb 14

High Treason says...

I thought they had a site already at Brecon Close, an area fenced off creating a total mess and more machinery there churning the nature reserve to mud. Is this for the travellers.
I thought they had a site already at Brecon Close, an area fenced off creating a total mess and more machinery there churning the nature reserve to mud. Is this for the travellers. High Treason
  • Score: 6

8:30am Tue 4 Feb 14

B'mth bred says...

We do have a site suitable. The old kinson swimming pool site is more than suitable, it has all the amenities of water, electricity and gas, it has sewage pluming to the mains. For a minimal amount of expenditure this site could be easily adapted
Could someone in the council explain why this site is not acceptable.
We do have a site suitable. The old kinson swimming pool site is more than suitable, it has all the amenities of water, electricity and gas, it has sewage pluming to the mains. For a minimal amount of expenditure this site could be easily adapted Could someone in the council explain why this site is not acceptable. B'mth bred
  • Score: 0

8:30am Tue 4 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........ Carolyn43
  • Score: 11

8:39am Tue 4 Feb 14

muscliffman says...

Head for Bournemouth? Probably wishful thinking by a few Poole Councillors who believe after their recent disgraceful decisions they can still save themselves from the inevitable come next polling day.

Truthfully it seems unlikely that the 'travellers' will take the slightest notice of any special sites in this area next summer and will set up their illegal 'holiday' camps wherever and whenever they please as is the norm. It seems equally likely on plentiful past evidence that our Police and the Council's will probably do little more but sit and watch the law abiding taxpayers suffering whilst citing all sorts of bureaucratic and legal nonsense for their own inexcusable inaction - it is after all their default easiest option!

Time to stop tinkering with the detail on this subject and look to more courageous local and national politicians who do recognise majority public opinion and will seek to urgently change the UK's PC law/s - that none of us can ever remember asking for - which perversely recognise these 'travellers' when in our Country as an apparently untouchable 'ethnic' race.
Head for Bournemouth? Probably wishful thinking by a few Poole Councillors who believe after their recent disgraceful decisions they can still save themselves from the inevitable come next polling day. Truthfully it seems unlikely that the 'travellers' will take the slightest notice of any special sites in this area next summer and will set up their illegal 'holiday' camps wherever and whenever they please as is the norm. It seems equally likely on plentiful past evidence that our Police and the Council's will probably do little more but sit and watch the law abiding taxpayers suffering whilst citing all sorts of bureaucratic and legal nonsense for their own inexcusable inaction - it is after all their default easiest option! Time to stop tinkering with the detail on this subject and look to more courageous local and national politicians who do recognise majority public opinion and will seek to urgently change the UK's PC law/s - that none of us can ever remember asking for - which perversely recognise these 'travellers' when in our Country as an apparently untouchable 'ethnic' race. muscliffman
  • Score: 24

8:51am Tue 4 Feb 14

muscliffman says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on?

Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry!
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on? Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry! muscliffman
  • Score: 26

9:17am Tue 4 Feb 14

BIGTONE says...

Cllr Phil Eades, Mayor of Poole, said: “I honestly believe that if Poole complies with the legislation, travellers will stop coming here..........


I don't. In fact probably the opposite. There will be an exodus of travellers rushing to get the pitches on a first come,first served basis leaving plenty of straggles unable to pitch on the legal site.
Then it's back to square one because the local authorities don't have a plan B when this happens.
Cllr Phil Eades, Mayor of Poole, said: “I honestly believe that if Poole complies with the legislation, travellers will stop coming here.......... I don't. In fact probably the opposite. There will be an exodus of travellers rushing to get the pitches on a first come,first served basis leaving plenty of straggles unable to pitch on the legal site. Then it's back to square one because the local authorities don't have a plan B when this happens. BIGTONE
  • Score: 11

9:44am Tue 4 Feb 14

spooki says...

I wonder, instead of asking "why not have a travellers site in Bournemouth?" have they asked "why don't we already have a travellers site in Bournemouth?".
I for one could give a few reasons such as rubbish and human excrement left behind and damaged fences/property.
I wonder, instead of asking "why not have a travellers site in Bournemouth?" have they asked "why don't we already have a travellers site in Bournemouth?". I for one could give a few reasons such as rubbish and human excrement left behind and damaged fences/property. spooki
  • Score: 18

9:46am Tue 4 Feb 14

bluto999 says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services. bluto999
  • Score: -37

9:57am Tue 4 Feb 14

snowy123 says...

B'mth bred wrote:
We do have a site suitable. The old kinson swimming pool site is more than suitable, it has all the amenities of water, electricity and gas, it has sewage pluming to the mains. For a minimal amount of expenditure this site could be easily adapted
Could someone in the council explain why this site is not acceptable.
I'm pretty sure that there is some environment law stating that you cannot develop an area within 400 metres of a site of special interest. Kinson common is one of the very few " natural " areas left in Bournemouth and I'm sure that they wouldn't want it ruined for the sake of this.
Due to extreme over development, Bournemouth has very little green space which is not surrounded by residential areas. The only such area is the corridor which runs along the river from Kinson to Iford. These have already been dismissed as potential sites so I really don't think there is anywhere suitable in the town.
[quote][p][bold]B'mth bred[/bold] wrote: We do have a site suitable. The old kinson swimming pool site is more than suitable, it has all the amenities of water, electricity and gas, it has sewage pluming to the mains. For a minimal amount of expenditure this site could be easily adapted Could someone in the council explain why this site is not acceptable.[/p][/quote]I'm pretty sure that there is some environment law stating that you cannot develop an area within 400 metres of a site of special interest. Kinson common is one of the very few " natural " areas left in Bournemouth and I'm sure that they wouldn't want it ruined for the sake of this. Due to extreme over development, Bournemouth has very little green space which is not surrounded by residential areas. The only such area is the corridor which runs along the river from Kinson to Iford. These have already been dismissed as potential sites so I really don't think there is anywhere suitable in the town. snowy123
  • Score: 10

10:01am Tue 4 Feb 14

Wackerone says...

We keep getting told that Irish travellers are an ethnic group, by definition. People of a certain religion, culture or speaking the same language. It would be interesting to see what would happen if a bunch of Polish Roman Catholics rocked up and set up camp somewhere in Bournemouth. Come to that, a convoy of English Christians or some Mormons from Utah!
We keep getting told that Irish travellers are an ethnic group, by definition. People of a certain religion, culture or speaking the same language. It would be interesting to see what would happen if a bunch of Polish Roman Catholics rocked up and set up camp somewhere in Bournemouth. Come to that, a convoy of English Christians or some Mormons from Utah! Wackerone
  • Score: 19

10:12am Tue 4 Feb 14

iseestupidpeople says...

If travellers were decent, law abiding, tax paying citizens they'd be welcomed anywhere with open arms. Why can't people get it into their thick heads that travellers aren't discriminated against because they travel or are nomadic, it's because they can't live within the laws of our land and respect others and their property!
If travellers were decent, law abiding, tax paying citizens they'd be welcomed anywhere with open arms. Why can't people get it into their thick heads that travellers aren't discriminated against because they travel or are nomadic, it's because they can't live within the laws of our land and respect others and their property! iseestupidpeople
  • Score: 45

10:16am Tue 4 Feb 14

speedy231278 says...

"enforcement powers “can only be used where vacant pitches on a traveller site are available within the same local authority area.” "

So, after shoving the two scheme through against the wishes of the residents, if one more caravan turns up than there are pitches for, it can go where it likes without fear of eviction for about a week while the authorities faff about with paperwork? In other words, the 'advantages' of having said pitches which were stated as the reasons the councillors forced the issue through are actually relying on there not being more demand than supply. In other words, they are useless, unless the law is amended to say that if all the pitches are occupied, tough luck, try the next district....
"enforcement powers “can only be used where vacant pitches on a traveller site are available within the same local authority area.” " So, after shoving the two scheme through against the wishes of the residents, if one more caravan turns up than there are pitches for, it can go where it likes without fear of eviction for about a week while the authorities faff about with paperwork? In other words, the 'advantages' of having said pitches which were stated as the reasons the councillors forced the issue through are actually relying on there not being more demand than supply. In other words, they are useless, unless the law is amended to say that if all the pitches are occupied, tough luck, try the next district.... speedy231278
  • Score: 7

10:16am Tue 4 Feb 14

bluto999 says...

muscliffman wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on?

Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry!
He's saying we should treat all people with dignity. I agree with him. It's a shame you see this as naive and laughable.
I'm glad Revd. Peter mentioned the nazis here. We need to be reminded of what happens when a society stops treating all the people within it with dignity.
[quote][p][bold]muscliffman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on? Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry![/p][/quote]He's saying we should treat all people with dignity. I agree with him. It's a shame you see this as naive and laughable. I'm glad Revd. Peter mentioned the nazis here. We need to be reminded of what happens when a society stops treating all the people within it with dignity. bluto999
  • Score: -32

10:17am Tue 4 Feb 14

afcb-mark says...

bluto999 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..
[quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.[/p][/quote]Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them.. afcb-mark
  • Score: 26

10:28am Tue 4 Feb 14

speedy231278 says...

"Unless an alternative site exists the police cannot use their powers to move the travellers on."

Why is this the case? They can break the law because they are registered as an ethnic group? Why should the Police be unable to move people on who are trespassing and/or parking illegally? If they can afford massive caravans and brand new pickup trucks, they can afford pitch fees.

I trust that entrance to these sites will only be permitted to vehicles that are fully taxed, insured and MOTd?
"Unless an alternative site exists the police cannot use their powers to move the travellers on." Why is this the case? They can break the law because they are registered as an ethnic group? Why should the Police be unable to move people on who are trespassing and/or parking illegally? If they can afford massive caravans and brand new pickup trucks, they can afford pitch fees. I trust that entrance to these sites will only be permitted to vehicles that are fully taxed, insured and MOTd? speedy231278
  • Score: 19

10:34am Tue 4 Feb 14

oversixty says...

B'mth bred wrote:
We do have a site suitable. The old kinson swimming pool site is more than suitable, it has all the amenities of water, electricity and gas, it has sewage pluming to the mains. For a minimal amount of expenditure this site could be easily adapted
Could someone in the council explain why this site is not acceptable.
It cannot be used for such purposes as it is close by Kinson Common where the heathland has restrictions on any development etc within certain limits to protect it.
The "travellers" have tried in the past few years to gain access to the Common but thankfully were unsuccessful!
[quote][p][bold]B'mth bred[/bold] wrote: We do have a site suitable. The old kinson swimming pool site is more than suitable, it has all the amenities of water, electricity and gas, it has sewage pluming to the mains. For a minimal amount of expenditure this site could be easily adapted Could someone in the council explain why this site is not acceptable.[/p][/quote]It cannot be used for such purposes as it is close by Kinson Common where the heathland has restrictions on any development etc within certain limits to protect it. The "travellers" have tried in the past few years to gain access to the Common but thankfully were unsuccessful! oversixty
  • Score: 5

10:36am Tue 4 Feb 14

new2it says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
In Biblical times, people would have to travel long slow journeys to reach a destination, therefor hospitality and refreshment would be expected and quite rightly given. Probably many of those long ago travellers would be merchants, No trains, cars or planes then. The travellers of today appear to expect the right to stay wherever they choose, be it on private or public land, very often forcing organised events to be cancelled, then when they do finally move on,they leave behind destruction, and a vast amount of waste, and filth, that the local councils are obliged to remove, at the expense of our rates and taxes. Forgive me if I don't equate todays travellers with those of the Bible. I have every compassion and sympathy with the homeless and those in need, and will continue to do all I can within my capabilities to help, but I'm afraid it doesn't extend to the travellers. Maybe if they conformed to fit in with today's society, paying tax and rates etc in the way most of us do, then there may be more compassion. It is because of the experiences many have had with travellers that there is such a reluctance to give them a site.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]In Biblical times, people would have to travel long slow journeys to reach a destination, therefor hospitality and refreshment would be expected and quite rightly given. Probably many of those long ago travellers would be merchants, No trains, cars or planes then. The travellers of today appear to expect the right to stay wherever they choose, be it on private or public land, very often forcing organised events to be cancelled, then when they do finally move on,they leave behind destruction, and a vast amount of waste, and filth, that the local councils are obliged to remove, at the expense of our rates and taxes. Forgive me if I don't equate todays travellers with those of the Bible. I have every compassion and sympathy with the homeless and those in need, and will continue to do all I can within my capabilities to help, but I'm afraid it doesn't extend to the travellers. Maybe if they conformed to fit in with today's society, paying tax and rates etc in the way most of us do, then there may be more compassion. It is because of the experiences many have had with travellers that there is such a reluctance to give them a site. new2it
  • Score: 18

10:38am Tue 4 Feb 14

Arjay says...

Rather than attempt to provide 'official' sites (which will always be too small anyway) why not optimise the allocation of resources to deal with this problem by speeding up the eviction process for illegal encampments?

Ensuring that the facilties to meet the legal and social service requirements of the existing legislation are always in place could mean that the police could serve eviction notices within a few hours rather than a few days.
If the evicted travellers move on to somewhere else nearby... activate the process again... immediately.
More expensive initially... but much cheaper to clear up after a group who have only been allowed to stay in one place for a matter of minutes or hours, rather than for several days....

And perhaps the powers that be could send a team to Ireland, to find out how that country manages to refuse to allow their own travellers any 'special status'.....
After all, both countries are working to the same 'EU' regulations here, surely?.....
Rather than attempt to provide 'official' sites (which will always be too small anyway) why not optimise the allocation of resources to deal with this problem by speeding up the eviction process for illegal encampments? Ensuring that the facilties to meet the legal and social service requirements of the existing legislation are always in place could mean that the police could serve eviction notices within a few hours rather than a few days. If the evicted travellers move on to somewhere else nearby... activate the process again... immediately. More expensive initially... but much cheaper to clear up after a group who have only been allowed to stay in one place for a matter of minutes or hours, rather than for several days.... And perhaps the powers that be could send a team to Ireland, to find out how that country manages to refuse to allow their own travellers any 'special status'..... After all, both countries are working to the same 'EU' regulations here, surely?..... Arjay
  • Score: 11

10:41am Tue 4 Feb 14

Rabbitman64 says...

Quite laughable to see the comment of Burns the tory mp! It was his idol Thatcher who removed the right to supply space for Gypsies in the first place? Now we have this chaos & prejudice coming out!
Quite laughable to see the comment of Burns the tory mp! It was his idol Thatcher who removed the right to supply space for Gypsies in the first place? Now we have this chaos & prejudice coming out! Rabbitman64
  • Score: 1

10:49am Tue 4 Feb 14

60plus says...

There must be a field where they could go on the way to the steam fair ,let them pay rent to a farmer,O I forgot they don't pay rent only the local rate payers do that.
There must be a field where they could go on the way to the steam fair ,let them pay rent to a farmer,O I forgot they don't pay rent only the local rate payers do that. 60plus
  • Score: 14

10:52am Tue 4 Feb 14

muscliffman says...

speedy231278 wrote:
"Unless an alternative site exists the police cannot use their powers to move the travellers on."

Why is this the case? They can break the law because they are registered as an ethnic group? Why should the Police be unable to move people on who are trespassing and/or parking illegally? If they can afford massive caravans and brand new pickup trucks, they can afford pitch fees.

I trust that entrance to these sites will only be permitted to vehicles that are fully taxed, insured and MOTd?
Not much chance of those vehicles checks I guess, but then the Police and other Authorities have also turned a blind eye in the past to these 'Irish traveller' vehicles very often displaying DVLA (UK registered address) number plates and not Irish Republic ones that are perfectly legal for up to six months over here.
[quote][p][bold]speedy231278[/bold] wrote: "Unless an alternative site exists the police cannot use their powers to move the travellers on." Why is this the case? They can break the law because they are registered as an ethnic group? Why should the Police be unable to move people on who are trespassing and/or parking illegally? If they can afford massive caravans and brand new pickup trucks, they can afford pitch fees. I trust that entrance to these sites will only be permitted to vehicles that are fully taxed, insured and MOTd?[/p][/quote]Not much chance of those vehicles checks I guess, but then the Police and other Authorities have also turned a blind eye in the past to these 'Irish traveller' vehicles very often displaying DVLA (UK registered address) number plates and not Irish Republic ones that are perfectly legal for up to six months over here. muscliffman
  • Score: 9

11:08am Tue 4 Feb 14

politicaltrainspotter says...

Does the wheel' s come off their trailers in the winter ? No, because they are all tucked up in their homes.

No matter, how many approved site are given there will always be a group that park illegally.Then the police will come and assess and they may not be asked to move on because the risk of public order offences are too high.
Does the wheel' s come off their trailers in the winter ? No, because they are all tucked up in their homes. No matter, how many approved site are given there will always be a group that park illegally.Then the police will come and assess and they may not be asked to move on because the risk of public order offences are too high. politicaltrainspotter
  • Score: 6

11:30am Tue 4 Feb 14

bobthedestroyer says...

Let them use the land next to the sewage works off of the Wessex Way
Let them use the land next to the sewage works off of the Wessex Way bobthedestroyer
  • Score: 7

11:37am Tue 4 Feb 14

BmthNewshound says...

Bournemouth Council leader John Beesley has ruled out the possibility of finding a suitable site within the borough....... But plenty of sites available to sell off to property developers. This isn't about not having a suitable site its about Beesley's inability to deal with real issues - he's in denial about the problem of homelessness in the town and refuses to acknowledge that the Council must have a policy to deal with travellers .
.
Perhaps if travellers set up camp on the West Cliff and Beesley is faced with the wrath of the West Cliff Residents Association it might focus his mind especially leading up to his bid for re-election.
Bournemouth Council leader John Beesley has ruled out the possibility of finding a suitable site within the borough....... But plenty of sites available to sell off to property developers. This isn't about not having a suitable site its about Beesley's inability to deal with real issues - he's in denial about the problem of homelessness in the town and refuses to acknowledge that the Council must have a policy to deal with travellers . . Perhaps if travellers set up camp on the West Cliff and Beesley is faced with the wrath of the West Cliff Residents Association it might focus his mind especially leading up to his bid for re-election. BmthNewshound
  • Score: 7

11:56am Tue 4 Feb 14

surferjj says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I call Godwins's law!
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I call Godwins's law! surferjj
  • Score: 6

12:20pm Tue 4 Feb 14

moleman says...

alasdair1967 wrote:
Baysider wrote:
alasdair1967 wrote:
It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak,
How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs
To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost
Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard
Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.
About time the laws where changed then
Robert Syms MP for Poole is currently lobbying for a change in the law which will allow Bournemouth, Poole and Dorset to use the same Temporary Stopping Site and if this goes through then they can all use the Marshes End site in Creekmoor.. The site should get plenty of use then! What happened to doing the best for the people who voted for you Mr Syms?
[quote][p][bold]alasdair1967[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Baysider[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]alasdair1967[/bold] wrote: It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak, How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard[/p][/quote]Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.[/p][/quote]About time the laws where changed then[/p][/quote]Robert Syms MP for Poole is currently lobbying for a change in the law which will allow Bournemouth, Poole and Dorset to use the same Temporary Stopping Site and if this goes through then they can all use the Marshes End site in Creekmoor.. The site should get plenty of use then! What happened to doing the best for the people who voted for you Mr Syms? moleman
  • Score: 6

12:50pm Tue 4 Feb 14

JohnGS says...

In 1961 there was a Gipsy site at Thorny Hill. (Between Burley and Bransgore) with the ex airfield behind .
New houses where built to house the caravan based people and the caravans disappeared .
The disused Airfield (part of) could make a temporary site for travellers if well managed and an agreement between local towns could solve this problem and give the travellers a superb site.
However the reason people object to the travellers are that the leave rubbish.and human waste near their site.
On parkland and other land were they are not allowed to park could be spayed with farm manure to deter unwelcome visitors .
In 1961 there was a Gipsy site at Thorny Hill. (Between Burley and Bransgore) with the ex airfield behind . New houses where built to house the caravan based people and the caravans disappeared . The disused Airfield (part of) could make a temporary site for travellers if well managed and an agreement between local towns could solve this problem and give the travellers a superb site. However the reason people object to the travellers are that the leave rubbish.and human waste near their site. On parkland and other land were they are not allowed to park could be spayed with farm manure to deter unwelcome visitors . JohnGS
  • Score: 4

1:15pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 6

1:44pm Tue 4 Feb 14

ex-Bransgore says...

If these people are travellers then they don't need permanent sites, they travel!
If these people are travellers then they don't need permanent sites, they travel! ex-Bransgore
  • Score: 5

1:56pm Tue 4 Feb 14

MrPitiful says...

Quitew a few nominations here for potential sites.

I wonder how many of the above nominated sites are next to, or even within a mile or so, of the homes of those who have done the nominating?


None of us seem to want a site near where we live, work etc but unfortunately if no site is found, then we can't all start complaining in June/July wwhen the inevitable happens.

Just as it did last year, and the year before...
Quitew a few nominations here for potential sites. I wonder how many of the above nominated sites are next to, or even within a mile or so, of the homes of those who have done the nominating? None of us seem to want a site near where we live, work etc but unfortunately if no site is found, then we can't all start complaining in June/July wwhen the inevitable happens. Just as it did last year, and the year before... MrPitiful
  • Score: 1

2:02pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

MrPitiful wrote:
Quitew a few nominations here for potential sites.

I wonder how many of the above nominated sites are next to, or even within a mile or so, of the homes of those who have done the nominating?


None of us seem to want a site near where we live, work etc but unfortunately if no site is found, then we can't all start complaining in June/July wwhen the inevitable happens.

Just as it did last year, and the year before...
And years to come.anarchy wins when challenged by weak laws and a weak council's
[quote][p][bold]MrPitiful[/bold] wrote: Quitew a few nominations here for potential sites. I wonder how many of the above nominated sites are next to, or even within a mile or so, of the homes of those who have done the nominating? None of us seem to want a site near where we live, work etc but unfortunately if no site is found, then we can't all start complaining in June/July wwhen the inevitable happens. Just as it did last year, and the year before...[/p][/quote]And years to come.anarchy wins when challenged by weak laws and a weak council's kalebmoledirt
  • Score: -2

2:05pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Marty Caine UKIP says...

If Syms is lobbying to change the law in that way does this mean that Bournemouth council will be sharing the bill of £25,000 that Poole have allocated to the building of a transit site?
If Syms is lobbying to change the law in that way does this mean that Bournemouth council will be sharing the bill of £25,000 that Poole have allocated to the building of a transit site? Marty Caine UKIP
  • Score: 2

2:11pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Molecatcher says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand".

I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it?

That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society..

As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand". I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it? That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society.. As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you. Molecatcher
  • Score: 12

2:23pm Tue 4 Feb 14

BIGTONE says...

bluto999 wrote:
muscliffman wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on?

Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry!
He's saying we should treat all people with dignity. I agree with him. It's a shame you see this as naive and laughable.
I'm glad Revd. Peter mentioned the nazis here. We need to be reminded of what happens when a society stops treating all the people within it with dignity.
We treat too many people with dignity,tolerance and money 24/7 and people are fed up with it.
When leeches on society decide they don't want something for nothing at the expense of others then they will be shown some respect,dignity and tolerance.
Existence is not a 1 way street.
[quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]muscliffman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on? Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry![/p][/quote]He's saying we should treat all people with dignity. I agree with him. It's a shame you see this as naive and laughable. I'm glad Revd. Peter mentioned the nazis here. We need to be reminded of what happens when a society stops treating all the people within it with dignity.[/p][/quote]We treat too many people with dignity,tolerance and money 24/7 and people are fed up with it. When leeches on society decide they don't want something for nothing at the expense of others then they will be shown some respect,dignity and tolerance. Existence is not a 1 way street. BIGTONE
  • Score: 10

2:32pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Baysider says...

alasdair1967 wrote:
Baysider wrote:
alasdair1967 wrote:
It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak,
How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs
To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost
Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard
Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.
About time the laws where changed then
...so to clarify, you didn't read the story and you haven't taken notice on the numerous other occasions the issue's been discussed but that didn't stop you from commenting on it and making up your own laws.

Sounds about par for the course around here...
[quote][p][bold]alasdair1967[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Baysider[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]alasdair1967[/bold] wrote: It gets targeted every year as it is ! Why don't Bournemouth and Poole council share the expense and rent somewhere like canford arena or even matchems for the months prior to the steam fair ,as this is the time when the issue is at it's peak, How much does each council pay for eviction notices and warrants to move them on then the cost of cleaning up each site, police and bailiff costs To me it would make sense to have one large dedicated site in the area both councils sharing the cost Anyone found setting up camp illegally in disregard to the provide site should be prosecuted and maybe impound there property time for the council to be seen coming down hard[/p][/quote]Did you bother to read the story? Your question is answered as to why they can't share a site.[/p][/quote]About time the laws where changed then[/p][/quote]...so to clarify, you didn't read the story and you haven't taken notice on the numerous other occasions the issue's been discussed but that didn't stop you from commenting on it and making up your own laws. Sounds about par for the course around here... Baysider
  • Score: -3

2:40pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Molecatcher says...

bluto999 wrote:
muscliffman wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on?

Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry!
He's saying we should treat all people with dignity. I agree with him. It's a shame you see this as naive and laughable.
I'm glad Revd. Peter mentioned the nazis here. We need to be reminded of what happens when a society stops treating all the people within it with dignity.
It cuts both ways though, doesn't it? I'm sure there would be less objection, maybe even none at all, if the nomads treated the sites provided and the people living around them with a degree of respect. But they don't... Hence the problem.
[quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]muscliffman[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]Good grief is this for real. What remote fantasy planet does this naïve individual live on? Religion, so often you just have to laugh - or you really would cry![/p][/quote]He's saying we should treat all people with dignity. I agree with him. It's a shame you see this as naive and laughable. I'm glad Revd. Peter mentioned the nazis here. We need to be reminded of what happens when a society stops treating all the people within it with dignity.[/p][/quote]It cuts both ways though, doesn't it? I'm sure there would be less objection, maybe even none at all, if the nomads treated the sites provided and the people living around them with a degree of respect. But they don't... Hence the problem. Molecatcher
  • Score: 10

4:01pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Poole Pirate wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
And exactly what idealistic planet are you from ?. If I come and cr@p on your doorstep, leave all my rubbish in your garden and rip-off your elderly neighbour and tell you that it's the 'nomadic-way', you'll be OK with that will you ? - I don't think so.
The point about having dedicated Travellers' Sites is to avoid the problems Poole Pirate is concerned about, particularly if there is educational support for the site.
[quote][p][bold]Poole Pirate[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]And exactly what idealistic planet are you from ?. If I come and cr@p on your doorstep, leave all my rubbish in your garden and rip-off your elderly neighbour and tell you that it's the 'nomadic-way', you'll be OK with that will you ? - I don't think so.[/p][/quote]The point about having dedicated Travellers' Sites is to avoid the problems Poole Pirate is concerned about, particularly if there is educational support for the site. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -6

4:05pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

kalebmoledirt wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
Any spare room in your church yard ?
I am retired, so have no Church yard. Although born and brought up in Bournemouth, I now live in Breizh, Brittany, and here there are dedicated sites for "Forains".
[quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]Any spare room in your church yard ?[/p][/quote]I am retired, so have no Church yard. Although born and brought up in Bournemouth, I now live in Breizh, Brittany, and here there are dedicated sites for "Forains". The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -9

4:10pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

TheDistrict wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
What a pathetic comment, and to use the Nazi scenario to get a message across. We are not Nazis, which had no regard for anyone but themselves. On the matter of traveller sites, the vast majority have indicated they do not want them in Bournemouth, such as Madeira Road, Muscliff, etc, but are happy with in reason to have them located at such locations as Canford Arena, Matchams and such spaces, away from the town, and away from built up areas. At the same time, true residents of Bournemouth and indeed Poole what assurity that travellers will be responsible for their own waste, and forced to remove before moving on. As stated not only in this story but many before on this subject, the large majority of travellers arrive before the Steam Rally, therefore giving them a large area to park up prior to the show, is a better option, rather than having small pockets parked in many car parks, parks, and open space areas designed for the public use. The owner of the fields for the Steam Rally should open his gates 3 months before the fair so that the travellers can park up and stay out of the way of the people of Bournemouth and Poole.

A man of God, surely must think more of his greater flock than a few travellers that are only passing through to the fair.
The point about the Nazis is that they did murder a great number of travellers, intellectuals, clergy, jews, communists, disabled, simple minded etc, all of whom were on the margins of society.
The Travellers in Europe are Citizens, and so provision should be made for them. They pay taxes just like the rest of us.
[quote][p][bold]TheDistrict[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]What a pathetic comment, and to use the Nazi scenario to get a message across. We are not Nazis, which had no regard for anyone but themselves. On the matter of traveller sites, the vast majority have indicated they do not want them in Bournemouth, such as Madeira Road, Muscliff, etc, but are happy with in reason to have them located at such locations as Canford Arena, Matchams and such spaces, away from the town, and away from built up areas. At the same time, true residents of Bournemouth and indeed Poole what assurity that travellers will be responsible for their own waste, and forced to remove before moving on. As stated not only in this story but many before on this subject, the large majority of travellers arrive before the Steam Rally, therefore giving them a large area to park up prior to the show, is a better option, rather than having small pockets parked in many car parks, parks, and open space areas designed for the public use. The owner of the fields for the Steam Rally should open his gates 3 months before the fair so that the travellers can park up and stay out of the way of the people of Bournemouth and Poole. A man of God, surely must think more of his greater flock than a few travellers that are only passing through to the fair.[/p][/quote]The point about the Nazis is that they did murder a great number of travellers, intellectuals, clergy, jews, communists, disabled, simple minded etc, all of whom were on the margins of society. The Travellers in Europe are Citizens, and so provision should be made for them. They pay taxes just like the rest of us. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -7

4:10pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jo__Go says...

Slightly more space for sites in Brittany than in Poole...
Slightly more space for sites in Brittany than in Poole... Jo__Go
  • Score: 7

4:16pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

new2it wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
In Biblical times, people would have to travel long slow journeys to reach a destination, therefor hospitality and refreshment would be expected and quite rightly given. Probably many of those long ago travellers would be merchants, No trains, cars or planes then. The travellers of today appear to expect the right to stay wherever they choose, be it on private or public land, very often forcing organised events to be cancelled, then when they do finally move on,they leave behind destruction, and a vast amount of waste, and filth, that the local councils are obliged to remove, at the expense of our rates and taxes. Forgive me if I don't equate todays travellers with those of the Bible. I have every compassion and sympathy with the homeless and those in need, and will continue to do all I can within my capabilities to help, but I'm afraid it doesn't extend to the travellers. Maybe if they conformed to fit in with today's society, paying tax and rates etc in the way most of us do, then there may be more compassion. It is because of the experiences many have had with travellers that there is such a reluctance to give them a site.
The purpose of Travellers' Sites is to avoid the problems that you have described.
[quote][p][bold]new2it[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]In Biblical times, people would have to travel long slow journeys to reach a destination, therefor hospitality and refreshment would be expected and quite rightly given. Probably many of those long ago travellers would be merchants, No trains, cars or planes then. The travellers of today appear to expect the right to stay wherever they choose, be it on private or public land, very often forcing organised events to be cancelled, then when they do finally move on,they leave behind destruction, and a vast amount of waste, and filth, that the local councils are obliged to remove, at the expense of our rates and taxes. Forgive me if I don't equate todays travellers with those of the Bible. I have every compassion and sympathy with the homeless and those in need, and will continue to do all I can within my capabilities to help, but I'm afraid it doesn't extend to the travellers. Maybe if they conformed to fit in with today's society, paying tax and rates etc in the way most of us do, then there may be more compassion. It is because of the experiences many have had with travellers that there is such a reluctance to give them a site.[/p][/quote]The purpose of Travellers' Sites is to avoid the problems that you have described. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -3

4:34pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

afcb-mark wrote:
bluto999 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..
Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.
[quote][p][bold]afcb-mark[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.[/p][/quote]Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..[/p][/quote]Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -9

4:37pm Tue 4 Feb 14

arthur1948 says...

winter gargens site would be perfect....or the car park infront of the town hall
winter gargens site would be perfect....or the car park infront of the town hall arthur1948
  • Score: 1

4:38pm Tue 4 Feb 14

arthur1948 says...

we treat imigrants better than travellers
we treat imigrants better than travellers arthur1948
  • Score: 1

4:38pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........[/p][/quote]Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -4

4:43pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

iseestupidpeople wrote:
If travellers were decent, law abiding, tax paying citizens they'd be welcomed anywhere with open arms. Why can't people get it into their thick heads that travellers aren't discriminated against because they travel or are nomadic, it's because they can't live within the laws of our land and respect others and their property!
Travellers have their own moral code, and it is different to that of settled people. I am sure that they would say that they suffer discrimination when they obey the law, for their life style. Better to treat people as agreeable until they prove other wise.
[quote][p][bold]iseestupidpeople[/bold] wrote: If travellers were decent, law abiding, tax paying citizens they'd be welcomed anywhere with open arms. Why can't people get it into their thick heads that travellers aren't discriminated against because they travel or are nomadic, it's because they can't live within the laws of our land and respect others and their property![/p][/quote]Travellers have their own moral code, and it is different to that of settled people. I am sure that they would say that they suffer discrimination when they obey the law, for their life style. Better to treat people as agreeable until they prove other wise. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -10

4:46pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
[quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -6

4:52pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Molecatcher wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand".

I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it?

That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society..

As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.
I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.
[quote][p][bold]Molecatcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand". I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it? That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society.. As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.[/p][/quote]I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -7

5:17pm Tue 4 Feb 14

pete woodley says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.[/p][/quote]How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory. pete woodley
  • Score: 7

5:21pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jo__Go says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation? Jo__Go
  • Score: 7

5:38pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Desperado says...

Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
[quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ! Desperado
  • Score: 5

5:41pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jeff in Parkstone says...

Comment reported - with reason ... :

smhinto : " ....utilise the local refuse recycling plant as a transit site for these mis-fits".

That is a racist comment ....

recycling plant images of camps 1940s ....
Comment reported - with reason ... : smhinto : " ....utilise the local refuse recycling plant as a transit site for these mis-fits". That is a racist comment .... recycling plant images of camps 1940s .... Jeff in Parkstone
  • Score: -6

5:48pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jeff in Parkstone says...

Lengthy letter to Whitecliffe area Resident Assocation Secretary, Poole Clrs and local MPs :

Accommodating Travellers in Poole, B'mouth & East Dorset

" ... we have been through this all before havn't we.

It is a complex and fraught issue.

As we see coverage every day in the Echo, some of that as today Fear B'mouth could become target I would say firing the issue up - "fears loom" - our towns as "targets" - along with all the language of "incursions" and "enforcement" and from Colin Lambert "felonies" ....

But that said I accept you and others make an important point - who are these travellers ?

It has become a catch all label for anyone with a caravan who stops on any open grounds.

So on this perhaps the Echo team - and council traveller liaison officers - can do us all a huge service and let us know what actually are we talking about.

Are we as you are saying talking about just about anyone who wants to take a holiday near the coast and park up on a local rec ? I must say the Echo photo today a "commercial van" with **ladders** on top is very puzzling ??? ...

Or are we talking about general summer holiday travellers from cities - or year round travellers - or Romanies or Irish or Gypsies or just about anyone from Europe or anywhere who wants to travel ?

And the group Gypsies it would seem because of their rarily now about the last group we would be talking about.

I don't know but whatever group they belong to I do not see enforcement and evictions leads to anything but very aggressive confrontations - as we have seen many many times in many areas over all the years.

As for the law on the whole matter it ends in my view a complete nonsense when we have to set up a minimal site at considerable expense so as to move travellers off other huge open areas where, although there is more than enough open grounds to take hundreds of vans let alone ten, they are not wanted by local residents.

And that takes us the anti-social behaviour part. I don't doubt there has been anti-social and upsetting behaviour. But I say again with all repsect to all residents in these areas cannot this be managed ? ... are you sure it is not outright hostility from local residents (in groups glaring over from a distance at the travellers) that is racking up the whole issue ? And that along with no refuse collections and so huge amounts of shocking litter building up every day ...

As Cllr Eades says these people know the law - and indeed will play the law (I think understandably to find a pitch) - and I would add to that they are not stupid and I would say they often have contempt for local people that give them a hard time. They're given a hard time they give a hard time back.

And my point on this to ...... .......... the last few days - we have a good share of anti-social behaviour in our area - drugs, shop lifting, vehicles driving up on our pavements every day, violance (fight outside one pub a week back) and so it goes but we don't condemn all residents or the young people from all familes do we. And same with travellers whatever has happend that was anti-social we surely should not be putting that on to all travellers - because for instance some youths got hold of a car and were driving over the grounds ...

The issue in the end is for council, Cllrs, and residents groups near Recs. But as a view - and bearing in mind Cllrs and residents stopped the "fun fair" coming to our local Rec years ago - and then blocked all development of football sports facilties (debatable but out and out no from residents group at Rec) - my view is that it should be possible to accommodate small groups (up to ten vans) for limited periods (max four weeks) on sections of all Poole large recreation grounds. And I would say particularly at Whitecliff/Baiter as by far the largest wide open public areas in the whole borough.

I can see no reason why not. It would be a trial for one year. Sections of Recs as formal camps for limited periods .... if it doesn't work then I assume that descision could then be revoked and end of trial. But then it could work and work well everyone might even breathe a sigh of relief - travellers not so bad as everyone had thought given half a chance "once you get to know some of them" ...

I mean really all I saw at Branksome last summer they were families - with children and pets ... one I saw reading the Echo ... wonder what she thought of the coverage ?

Jeff Williams
Lengthy letter to Whitecliffe area Resident Assocation Secretary, Poole Clrs and local MPs : Accommodating Travellers in Poole, B'mouth & East Dorset " ... we have been through this all before havn't we. It is a complex and fraught issue. As we see coverage every day in the Echo, some of that as today Fear B'mouth could become target I would say firing the issue up - "fears loom" - our towns as "targets" - along with all the language of "incursions" and "enforcement" and from Colin Lambert "felonies" .... But that said I accept you and others make an important point - who are these travellers ? It has become a catch all label for anyone with a caravan who stops on any open grounds. So on this perhaps the Echo team - and council traveller liaison officers - can do us all a huge service and let us know what actually are we talking about. Are we as you are saying talking about just about anyone who wants to take a holiday near the coast and park up on a local rec ? I must say the Echo photo today a "commercial van" with **ladders** on top is very puzzling ??? ... Or are we talking about general summer holiday travellers from cities - or year round travellers - or Romanies or Irish or Gypsies or just about anyone from Europe or anywhere who wants to travel ? And the group Gypsies it would seem because of their rarily now about the last group we would be talking about. I don't know but whatever group they belong to I do not see enforcement and evictions leads to anything but very aggressive confrontations - as we have seen many many times in many areas over all the years. As for the law on the whole matter it ends in my view a complete nonsense when we have to set up a minimal site at considerable expense so as to move travellers off other huge open areas where, although there is more than enough open grounds to take hundreds of vans let alone ten, they are not wanted by local residents. And that takes us the anti-social behaviour part. I don't doubt there has been anti-social and upsetting behaviour. But I say again with all repsect to all residents in these areas cannot this be managed ? ... are you sure it is not outright hostility from local residents (in groups glaring over from a distance at the travellers) that is racking up the whole issue ? And that along with no refuse collections and so huge amounts of shocking litter building up every day ... As Cllr Eades says these people know the law - and indeed will play the law (I think understandably to find a pitch) - and I would add to that they are not stupid and I would say they often have contempt for local people that give them a hard time. They're given a hard time they give a hard time back. And my point on this to ...... .......... the last few days - we have a good share of anti-social behaviour in our area - drugs, shop lifting, vehicles driving up on our pavements every day, violance (fight outside one pub a week back) and so it goes but we don't condemn all residents or the young people from all familes do we. And same with travellers whatever has happend that was anti-social we surely should not be putting that on to all travellers - because for instance some youths got hold of a car and were driving over the grounds ... The issue in the end is for council, Cllrs, and residents groups near Recs. But as a view - and bearing in mind Cllrs and residents stopped the "fun fair" coming to our local Rec years ago - and then blocked all development of football sports facilties (debatable but out and out no from residents group at Rec) - my view is that it should be possible to accommodate small groups (up to ten vans) for limited periods (max four weeks) on sections of all Poole large recreation grounds. And I would say particularly at Whitecliff/Baiter as by far the largest wide open public areas in the whole borough. I can see no reason why not. It would be a trial for one year. Sections of Recs as formal camps for limited periods .... if it doesn't work then I assume that descision could then be revoked and end of trial. But then it could work and work well everyone might even breathe a sigh of relief - travellers not so bad as everyone had thought given half a chance "once you get to know some of them" ... I mean really all I saw at Branksome last summer they were families - with children and pets ... one I saw reading the Echo ... wonder what she thought of the coverage ? Jeff Williams Jeff in Parkstone
  • Score: -4

5:54pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Molecatcher says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Molecatcher wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand".

I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it?

That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society..

As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.
I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.
Oh ok... were you part of the Church of England? Interesting that you have never found any assets of any size. OK, fair enough, but if you look at the Church of England web site, it says that in 2004 it took £1000 million to fund the church and gives a detailed breakdown of how that is spent. £160m is spent on maintenance of buildings and new building work... Maybe a small slice of that fund could be spent on providing a little bit of luxury for our poor old nomads. It also crows about the fact the fact that the parishes reclaimed £6m in VAT... A travellers site would surely cost a fraction of that, even a top notch one like you suggest. Anyway, I think it would be a fine and Christian gesture for the church to build a site for the nomads. It would help build a nice bridge between them and the settled community... Don't you think?
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Molecatcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand". I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it? That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society.. As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.[/p][/quote]I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.[/p][/quote]Oh ok... were you part of the Church of England? Interesting that you have never found any assets of any size. OK, fair enough, but if you look at the Church of England web site, it says that in 2004 it took £1000 million to fund the church and gives a detailed breakdown of how that is spent. £160m is spent on maintenance of buildings and new building work... Maybe a small slice of that fund could be spent on providing a little bit of luxury for our poor old nomads. It also crows about the fact the fact that the parishes reclaimed £6m in VAT... A travellers site would surely cost a fraction of that, even a top notch one like you suggest. Anyway, I think it would be a fine and Christian gesture for the church to build a site for the nomads. It would help build a nice bridge between them and the settled community... Don't you think? Molecatcher
  • Score: 6

6:13pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation
Knowledge.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........[/p][/quote]Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation[/p][/quote]Knowledge. Carolyn43
  • Score: 5

6:23pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jo__Go says...

Desperado wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...
[quote][p][bold]Desperado[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ![/p][/quote]He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany... Jo__Go
  • Score: 6

6:24pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
afcb-mark wrote:
bluto999 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..
Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.
They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU.
.......
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]afcb-mark[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.[/p][/quote]Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..[/p][/quote]Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.[/p][/quote]They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU. ....... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free. Carolyn43
  • Score: 5

7:02pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
We live in Normandy France .the travellers pass through camp on the cattle market hang their washing on the trees scour the area for odd jobs ,scrap metal gardening jobs that is is what travellers do ,wee in the brushes as did Winston Churchill And me, the Gendarms drive through every day.And then they are gone .No rubbish or any discord,PS none of them are from Ireland.in summary the French travellers have a similar opinion of Irish travellers as the Irish government
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.[/p][/quote]We live in Normandy France .the travellers pass through camp on the cattle market hang their washing on the trees scour the area for odd jobs ,scrap metal gardening jobs that is is what travellers do ,wee in the brushes as did Winston Churchill And me, the Gendarms drive through every day.And then they are gone .No rubbish or any discord,PS none of them are from Ireland.in summary the French travellers have a similar opinion of Irish travellers as the Irish government kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 2

7:02pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
We live in Normandy France .the travellers pass through camp on the cattle market hang their washing on the trees scour the area for odd jobs ,scrap metal gardening jobs that is is what travellers do ,wee in the brushes as did Winston Churchill And me, the Gendarms drive through every day.And then they are gone .No rubbish or any discord,PS none of them are from Ireland.in summary the French travellers have a similar opinion of Irish travellers as the Irish government
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.[/p][/quote]We live in Normandy France .the travellers pass through camp on the cattle market hang their washing on the trees scour the area for odd jobs ,scrap metal gardening jobs that is is what travellers do ,wee in the brushes as did Winston Churchill And me, the Gendarms drive through every day.And then they are gone .No rubbish or any discord,PS none of them are from Ireland.in summary the French travellers have a similar opinion of Irish travellers as the Irish government kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 1

7:06pm Tue 4 Feb 14

pete woodley says...

Desperado wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
So do i,his comments seem a bit dubious,it could be nicky doodah's kid sister.
[quote][p][bold]Desperado[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ![/p][/quote]So do i,his comments seem a bit dubious,it could be nicky doodah's kid sister. pete woodley
  • Score: 3

7:08pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

Jo__Go wrote:
Desperado wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...
Yes, indeed a wind up. He actually says he lives in Brittany, Brittany. It didn't take much to find out that Breizh is the Breton word for Brittany, and if he actually lived there he'd know that.
[quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Desperado[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ![/p][/quote]He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...[/p][/quote]Yes, indeed a wind up. He actually says he lives in Brittany, Brittany. It didn't take much to find out that Breizh is the Breton word for Brittany, and if he actually lived there he'd know that. Carolyn43
  • Score: 2

7:29pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
Desperado wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...
Yes, indeed a wind up. He actually says he lives in Brittany, Brittany. It didn't take much to find out that Breizh is the Breton word for Brittany, and if he actually lived there he'd know that.
No rad tax in France
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Desperado[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ![/p][/quote]He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...[/p][/quote]Yes, indeed a wind up. He actually says he lives in Brittany, Brittany. It didn't take much to find out that Breizh is the Breton word for Brittany, and if he actually lived there he'd know that.[/p][/quote]No rad tax in France kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 1

7:36pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

kalebmoledirt wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
Desperado wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...
Yes, indeed a wind up. He actually says he lives in Brittany, Brittany. It didn't take much to find out that Breizh is the Breton word for Brittany, and if he actually lived there he'd know that.
No rad tax in France
I think it may the Beachydickhead trying out his religious thoughts.give him a break trying to avoid a bolt of lightening
[quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Desperado[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ![/p][/quote]He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...[/p][/quote]Yes, indeed a wind up. He actually says he lives in Brittany, Brittany. It didn't take much to find out that Breizh is the Breton word for Brittany, and if he actually lived there he'd know that.[/p][/quote]No rad tax in France[/p][/quote]I think it may the Beachydickhead trying out his religious thoughts.give him a break trying to avoid a bolt of lightening kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 1

7:47pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

pete woodley wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.
I lived in Bournemouth from my birth in 1938 until I went to work in India in 1963
[quote][p][bold]pete woodley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.[/p][/quote]How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.[/p][/quote]I lived in Bournemouth from my birth in 1938 until I went to work in India in 1963 The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -1

7:56pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
The moment anyone buys anything in the European Union, they pay Value Added Tax, and for some things alcohol or petrol, there still to be added Excise duty, and as they have road vehicles they will be liable to Road Tax. When they use sites there will no doubt be charges, and in them there will be other taxes
[quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]The moment anyone buys anything in the European Union, they pay Value Added Tax, and for some things alcohol or petrol, there still to be added Excise duty, and as they have road vehicles they will be liable to Road Tax. When they use sites there will no doubt be charges, and in them there will be other taxes The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -6

8:01pm Tue 4 Feb 14

new2it says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
new2it wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
In Biblical times, people would have to travel long slow journeys to reach a destination, therefor hospitality and refreshment would be expected and quite rightly given. Probably many of those long ago travellers would be merchants, No trains, cars or planes then. The travellers of today appear to expect the right to stay wherever they choose, be it on private or public land, very often forcing organised events to be cancelled, then when they do finally move on,they leave behind destruction, and a vast amount of waste, and filth, that the local councils are obliged to remove, at the expense of our rates and taxes. Forgive me if I don't equate todays travellers with those of the Bible. I have every compassion and sympathy with the homeless and those in need, and will continue to do all I can within my capabilities to help, but I'm afraid it doesn't extend to the travellers. Maybe if they conformed to fit in with today's society, paying tax and rates etc in the way most of us do, then there may be more compassion. It is because of the experiences many have had with travellers that there is such a reluctance to give them a site.
The purpose of Travellers' Sites is to avoid the problems that you have described.
As I understand it, they are proposing transit sites, not permanent, so when they move on, will they make sure that they remove their rubbish and leave everything "nice and tidy"? Somehow I don't think so. As I pointed out, if they conformed to fit in with today's society, people would be more tolerant. I'm surprised to hear they pay tax etc, That is certainly news to me. Maybe you could also explain how it is that they can take over a council car park, with out paying for parking, as has happened in the past. Heaven help anybody else who stays a short time over their limit, they are presented with a fine. Is it any wonder people feel as they do?
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]new2it[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]In Biblical times, people would have to travel long slow journeys to reach a destination, therefor hospitality and refreshment would be expected and quite rightly given. Probably many of those long ago travellers would be merchants, No trains, cars or planes then. The travellers of today appear to expect the right to stay wherever they choose, be it on private or public land, very often forcing organised events to be cancelled, then when they do finally move on,they leave behind destruction, and a vast amount of waste, and filth, that the local councils are obliged to remove, at the expense of our rates and taxes. Forgive me if I don't equate todays travellers with those of the Bible. I have every compassion and sympathy with the homeless and those in need, and will continue to do all I can within my capabilities to help, but I'm afraid it doesn't extend to the travellers. Maybe if they conformed to fit in with today's society, paying tax and rates etc in the way most of us do, then there may be more compassion. It is because of the experiences many have had with travellers that there is such a reluctance to give them a site.[/p][/quote]The purpose of Travellers' Sites is to avoid the problems that you have described.[/p][/quote]As I understand it, they are proposing transit sites, not permanent, so when they move on, will they make sure that they remove their rubbish and leave everything "nice and tidy"? Somehow I don't think so. As I pointed out, if they conformed to fit in with today's society, people would be more tolerant. I'm surprised to hear they pay tax etc, That is certainly news to me. Maybe you could also explain how it is that they can take over a council car park, with out paying for parking, as has happened in the past. Heaven help anybody else who stays a short time over their limit, they are presented with a fine. Is it any wonder people feel as they do? new2it
  • Score: 3

8:04pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Molecatcher wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Molecatcher wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand".

I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it?

That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society..

As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.
I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.
Oh ok... were you part of the Church of England? Interesting that you have never found any assets of any size. OK, fair enough, but if you look at the Church of England web site, it says that in 2004 it took £1000 million to fund the church and gives a detailed breakdown of how that is spent. £160m is spent on maintenance of buildings and new building work... Maybe a small slice of that fund could be spent on providing a little bit of luxury for our poor old nomads. It also crows about the fact the fact that the parishes reclaimed £6m in VAT... A travellers site would surely cost a fraction of that, even a top notch one like you suggest. Anyway, I think it would be a fine and Christian gesture for the church to build a site for the nomads. It would help build a nice bridge between them and the settled community... Don't you think?
You have not written about assets but about expenditure.
[quote][p][bold]Molecatcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Molecatcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand". I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it? That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society.. As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.[/p][/quote]I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.[/p][/quote]Oh ok... were you part of the Church of England? Interesting that you have never found any assets of any size. OK, fair enough, but if you look at the Church of England web site, it says that in 2004 it took £1000 million to fund the church and gives a detailed breakdown of how that is spent. £160m is spent on maintenance of buildings and new building work... Maybe a small slice of that fund could be spent on providing a little bit of luxury for our poor old nomads. It also crows about the fact the fact that the parishes reclaimed £6m in VAT... A travellers site would surely cost a fraction of that, even a top notch one like you suggest. Anyway, I think it would be a fine and Christian gesture for the church to build a site for the nomads. It would help build a nice bridge between them and the settled community... Don't you think?[/p][/quote]You have not written about assets but about expenditure. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -1

8:07pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
The moment anyone buys anything in the European Union, they pay Value Added Tax, and for some things alcohol or petrol, there still to be added Excise duty, and as they have road vehicles they will be liable to Road Tax. When they use sites there will no doubt be charges, and in them there will be other taxes
There is no road tax in France,and why are they required to pay for sites in France and not in the UK ?
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]The moment anyone buys anything in the European Union, they pay Value Added Tax, and for some things alcohol or petrol, there still to be added Excise duty, and as they have road vehicles they will be liable to Road Tax. When they use sites there will no doubt be charges, and in them there will be other taxes[/p][/quote]There is no road tax in France,and why are they required to pay for sites in France and not in the UK ? kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 2

8:09pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation
Knowledge.
Please justify your claim of knowledge!
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........[/p][/quote]Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation[/p][/quote]Knowledge.[/p][/quote]Please justify your claim of knowledge! The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: 1

8:15pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Jo__Go wrote:
Desperado wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins says...

Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.

Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?
I think you will find he is winding you lot up !
He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...
In Bretagne, Breizh, Brittany, we use the British Language, Breizhenog and inb that language Breizh is British!
[quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Desperado[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins says... Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for. Is he writing on the basis of knowledge or is it simply an allegation?[/p][/quote]I think you will find he is winding you lot up ![/p][/quote]He does have the smell of a troll about him, particularly as he seems to suggest Breizh is a place in Brittany...[/p][/quote]In Bretagne, Breizh, Brittany, we use the British Language, Breizhenog and inb that language Breizh is British! The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -1

8:16pm Tue 4 Feb 14

pete woodley says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
pete woodley wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.
I lived in Bournemouth from my birth in 1938 until I went to work in India in 1963
With so many false names on here it is not surprising that you are thought of as a fake,especially as you give very little information about yourself,such as previous trade,etc.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pete woodley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.[/p][/quote]How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.[/p][/quote]I lived in Bournemouth from my birth in 1938 until I went to work in India in 1963[/p][/quote]With so many false names on here it is not surprising that you are thought of as a fake,especially as you give very little information about yourself,such as previous trade,etc. pete woodley
  • Score: 1

8:20pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation
Knowledge.
Please justify your claim of knowledge!
You obviously haven't read all the posts on here. See my post 6.24 pm: I repeat:
.........
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
And I do mean all aspects of their life.
......
My claim of knowledge justified.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........[/p][/quote]Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation[/p][/quote]Knowledge.[/p][/quote]Please justify your claim of knowledge![/p][/quote]You obviously haven't read all the posts on here. See my post 6.24 pm: I repeat: ......... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... And I do mean all aspects of their life. ...... My claim of knowledge justified. Carolyn43
  • Score: 1

8:22pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

Reverand Peter Hawkings swear on your Bible that you really are who you are and not what your pretending to be ?
Reverand Peter Hawkings swear on your Bible that you really are who you are and not what your pretending to be ? kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 1

8:25pm Tue 4 Feb 14

pete woodley says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
afcb-mark wrote:
bluto999 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..
Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.
They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU.
.......
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.
"in another life",sounds like you are a medium ?.
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]afcb-mark[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.[/p][/quote]Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..[/p][/quote]Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.[/p][/quote]They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU. ....... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.[/p][/quote]"in another life",sounds like you are a medium ?. pete woodley
  • Score: 1

8:27pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
afcb-mark wrote:
bluto999 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..
Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.
They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU.
.......
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.
As I suspected Carolyn43 has written using prejudice and not knowledge.
Her point about the different bits of Ireland is irrelevant, for travellers when they enter a different state have to pay Excise, and VAT at the least to the stata that they are not the one they came from. It is obvious!
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]afcb-mark[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.[/p][/quote]Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..[/p][/quote]Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.[/p][/quote]They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU. ....... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.[/p][/quote]As I suspected Carolyn43 has written using prejudice and not knowledge. Her point about the different bits of Ireland is irrelevant, for travellers when they enter a different state have to pay Excise, and VAT at the least to the stata that they are not the one they came from. It is obvious! The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -4

8:29pm Tue 4 Feb 14

kalebmoledirt says...

pete woodley wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
afcb-mark wrote:
bluto999 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.
Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..
Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.
They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU.
.......
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.
"in another life",sounds like you are a medium ?.
Just wish I needed a medium to communicate with him .the man is as mad as a meat axe
[quote][p][bold]pete woodley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]afcb-mark[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]bluto999[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]I agree, we should provide a decent well serviced campsite, with access to medical care and social services.[/p][/quote]Have them all in your back yards then. What a load of idealistic claptrap from the pair of you. The rest of us have to pay through our taxes for medical care and have to pay for everything else as well. They are free loaders who want everything and give nothing in return. I very much doubt they have ever infringed on your lives unlike others who find there are suddenly No Go areas across the town for fear of abuse, dog mess, being attacked by their dogs, abused by their kids and the rest of the crap that comes with them..[/p][/quote]Travellers pay Taxes, VAT, Excise, Road Tax, so they are entitled to appropriate provision, by the government that they pay for.[/p][/quote]They pay for the Irish, not British government. They come from Southern Ireland (Eire) not Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Southern Ireland is not - Eire is a separate country and has its own membership of the EU. ....... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... I had an official form to fill in today. The last part was to place a cross against my ethnic origin. Under 'White' one option was 'Romany or Irish Traveller'. I was tempted if only so I could park in local car parks for free.[/p][/quote]"in another life",sounds like you are a medium ?.[/p][/quote]Just wish I needed a medium to communicate with him .the man is as mad as a meat axe kalebmoledirt
  • Score: 3

8:35pm Tue 4 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation
Knowledge.
Please justify your claim of knowledge!
You obviously haven't read all the posts on here. See my post 6.24 pm: I repeat:
.........
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
And I do mean all aspects of their life.
......
My claim of knowledge justified.
To have declined a job does not imply knowledge§
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........[/p][/quote]Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation[/p][/quote]Knowledge.[/p][/quote]Please justify your claim of knowledge![/p][/quote]You obviously haven't read all the posts on here. See my post 6.24 pm: I repeat: ......... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... And I do mean all aspects of their life. ...... My claim of knowledge justified.[/p][/quote]To have declined a job does not imply knowledge§ The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: -3

9:03pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Molecatcher says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Molecatcher wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Molecatcher wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand.
It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed.
A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.
"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand".

I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it?

That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society..

As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.
I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.
Oh ok... were you part of the Church of England? Interesting that you have never found any assets of any size. OK, fair enough, but if you look at the Church of England web site, it says that in 2004 it took £1000 million to fund the church and gives a detailed breakdown of how that is spent. £160m is spent on maintenance of buildings and new building work... Maybe a small slice of that fund could be spent on providing a little bit of luxury for our poor old nomads. It also crows about the fact the fact that the parishes reclaimed £6m in VAT... A travellers site would surely cost a fraction of that, even a top notch one like you suggest. Anyway, I think it would be a fine and Christian gesture for the church to build a site for the nomads. It would help build a nice bridge between them and the settled community... Don't you think?
You have not written about assets but about expenditure.
From the Church of England website:

"As part of their commitment to providing a diverse portfolio of assets, the Church Commissioners for England hold a commercial property portfolio valued in December 2010 at £1.6 billion. "

I think that in fact you're not really a Reverend anything are you? You're actually Nickydoodah. Well done.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Molecatcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Molecatcher[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: We were all originally nomads, and whilst many of us have settled, some remain nomadic. Since the time of at least Cain and Abel, there has been conflict between those who are settled and have property to preserve, and those who are nomadic and take what is to hand. It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic. Such provision should be at least a decent well serviced camp site large enough for the demand. The services provided should ensure that the children and young people may be educated approproiately, and there should be medical and social services as needed. A society is judged by the way it treats those on the margins. We know how the Nazis treated those on the margins, let us do better.[/p][/quote]"Well serviced camp site large enough for the demand". I'm looking forward to the head line in the Echo where the Church leads from the front and sets an example to all of us sinners by selling some of it's assets to provide this Shangri La. It's not like the church can't afford it, now is it? That would solve the conflict between those who are settled and have to pay their share so that the 'civilized society' can exist, and the 'takers of what is to hand' who have opted out and just turn up for the steam fair once a year and wreak havoc having not contributed anything to society.. As for selective quotation of bits of scripture and references to the Nazis... Shame on you.[/p][/quote]I have served in the Ministry since 1963 until 2007, in India and England, and I have never found "assets" of any size. Nomadic peoples pay their "share" in Road Tax, Value Added Tax and Excise Duty at the least.[/p][/quote]Oh ok... were you part of the Church of England? Interesting that you have never found any assets of any size. OK, fair enough, but if you look at the Church of England web site, it says that in 2004 it took £1000 million to fund the church and gives a detailed breakdown of how that is spent. £160m is spent on maintenance of buildings and new building work... Maybe a small slice of that fund could be spent on providing a little bit of luxury for our poor old nomads. It also crows about the fact the fact that the parishes reclaimed £6m in VAT... A travellers site would surely cost a fraction of that, even a top notch one like you suggest. Anyway, I think it would be a fine and Christian gesture for the church to build a site for the nomads. It would help build a nice bridge between them and the settled community... Don't you think?[/p][/quote]You have not written about assets but about expenditure.[/p][/quote]From the Church of England website: "As part of their commitment to providing a diverse portfolio of assets, the Church Commissioners for England hold a commercial property portfolio valued in December 2010 at £1.6 billion. " I think that in fact you're not really a Reverend anything are you? You're actually Nickydoodah. Well done. Molecatcher
  • Score: 6

9:36pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
Carolyn43 wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic."
.......
They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here.
.......
Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp."
.......
Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........
Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation
Knowledge.
Please justify your claim of knowledge!
You obviously haven't read all the posts on here. See my post 6.24 pm: I repeat:
.........
In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined.
......
And I do mean all aspects of their life.
......
My claim of knowledge justified.
To have declined a job does not imply knowledge§
Researching the life of travellers probably gave me more knowledge about them, their family structures and way of life than most on here, and was the sensible thing to do before deciding whether or not I was suited to do the job for them, not prejudice. I suppose you think finding out all about nursing or teaching doesn't give you knowledge and shows prejudice if you decide the job isn't for you because you can't give it the commitment it deserves. Strange.
,,,,
And Pete "in another life" means before I retired - a totally different lifestyle to that of a person in full time work.
[quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: The Reverend Peter Hawkins said "It follows that in a society where all are citizens, that provision should be made for those citizens who are nomadic." ....... They're only nomadic for a short period of the year, just the same as the rest of us when we go on holiday or go abroad to work. Then they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland, just the same as we come back to our lovely permanent homes here. ....... Those who maintain this proposed site will solve the problem please note that MP Connor Burns has confirmed what many of us have said "However, even if we had provision and that was full, the police would still not have the powers to act against another illegal camp." ....... Apologies to those who couldn't access the link I quoted for the planning application. We'd been given a link with a typo. The correct application number is APP/14/00123/F and not APR........[/p][/quote]Is Carolyn43 writing on the basis of knowledge that "they go back to their lovely permanent homes in Ireland" or is it simply an allegation[/p][/quote]Knowledge.[/p][/quote]Please justify your claim of knowledge![/p][/quote]You obviously haven't read all the posts on here. See my post 6.24 pm: I repeat: ......... In another life, in another county I was offered a job of being educational liaison officer for travellers. Having researched into all aspects of traveller life I declined. ...... And I do mean all aspects of their life. ...... My claim of knowledge justified.[/p][/quote]To have declined a job does not imply knowledge§[/p][/quote]Researching the life of travellers probably gave me more knowledge about them, their family structures and way of life than most on here, and was the sensible thing to do before deciding whether or not I was suited to do the job for them, not prejudice. I suppose you think finding out all about nursing or teaching doesn't give you knowledge and shows prejudice if you decide the job isn't for you because you can't give it the commitment it deserves. Strange. ,,,, And Pete "in another life" means before I retired - a totally different lifestyle to that of a person in full time work. Carolyn43
  • Score: -1

9:59pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jo__Go says...

Oh, he's good. Trolling to a new level!
Oh, he's good. Trolling to a new level! Jo__Go
  • Score: 2

10:26pm Tue 4 Feb 14

Jo__Go says...

Seems he's a professional...

http://disqus.com/pe
terhawkins1/
Seems he's a professional... http://disqus.com/pe terhawkins1/ Jo__Go
  • Score: 2

11:56pm Tue 4 Feb 14

HRH of Boscombe says...

Bonjovigirl wrote:
No we do not want a travellers camp in Bournemouth, it's bad enough every summer seeing them in king's park and other places leaving a mess behind and letting their dogs and kids run riot !!!!!!
It's about playing the game doughnut!
.
Give them a patch in the back crack of town.
.
None of them are Romany and most claiming to be Irish probably grew up in Basildon. (forget bos-vegas it's always been bas-vegas)
.
Anyway it's a way of teeing up removal rights and if the Council's refuse to grow spines then this is the best way.
.
Maybe Bmth is waiting to see if Poole will show any teeth when they decide not to use the designated sites.
.
BTW why do we have to support so called Irish traveller rights that aren't even recognised in Ireland?
[quote][p][bold]Bonjovigirl[/bold] wrote: No we do not want a travellers camp in Bournemouth, it's bad enough every summer seeing them in king's park and other places leaving a mess behind and letting their dogs and kids run riot !!!!!![/p][/quote]It's about playing the game doughnut! . Give them a patch in the back crack of town. . None of them are Romany and most claiming to be Irish probably grew up in Basildon. (forget bos-vegas it's always been bas-vegas) . Anyway it's a way of teeing up removal rights and if the Council's refuse to grow spines then this is the best way. . Maybe Bmth is waiting to see if Poole will show any teeth when they decide not to use the designated sites. . BTW why do we have to support so called Irish traveller rights that aren't even recognised in Ireland? HRH of Boscombe
  • Score: -3

12:01am Wed 5 Feb 14

HRH of Boscombe says...

We should take our claim to the EU court. They're only an ethnic minority in British law.
.
They're F all in the EU
We should take our claim to the EU court. They're only an ethnic minority in British law. . They're F all in the EU HRH of Boscombe
  • Score: -2

7:39am Wed 5 Feb 14

ashleycross says...

swift action is not taken because it is not legal to move travellers on swiftly if there is no transit site available.
swift action is not taken because it is not legal to move travellers on swiftly if there is no transit site available. ashleycross
  • Score: 1

7:41am Wed 5 Feb 14

ashleycross says...

Bonjovigirl wrote:
No we do not want a travellers camp in Bournemouth, it's bad enough every summer seeing them in king's park and other places leaving a mess behind and letting their dogs and kids run riot !!!!!!
they are there every summer because that is the place the council have to let them use because there is no official site.
[quote][p][bold]Bonjovigirl[/bold] wrote: No we do not want a travellers camp in Bournemouth, it's bad enough every summer seeing them in king's park and other places leaving a mess behind and letting their dogs and kids run riot !!!!!![/p][/quote]they are there every summer because that is the place the council have to let them use because there is no official site. ashleycross
  • Score: 1

9:05am Wed 5 Feb 14

moleman says...

Marty Caine UKIP wrote:
If Syms is lobbying to change the law in that way does this mean that Bournemouth council will be sharing the bill of £25,000 that Poole have allocated to the building of a transit site?
It is £250,000 for the site plus £30,000 a year on-going costs for providing water, light and rubbish collection and clearing the mess after they leave,
[quote][p][bold]Marty Caine UKIP[/bold] wrote: If Syms is lobbying to change the law in that way does this mean that Bournemouth council will be sharing the bill of £25,000 that Poole have allocated to the building of a transit site?[/p][/quote]It is £250,000 for the site plus £30,000 a year on-going costs for providing water, light and rubbish collection and clearing the mess after they leave, moleman
  • Score: 2

9:11am Wed 5 Feb 14

Carolyn43 says...

Jo__Go wrote:
Seems he's a professional...

http://disqus.com/pe

terhawkins1/
Thanks for that link. Why should someone in France be commenting on something which doesn't affect him? - unless he has nothing better to do with his time than be a professional troll on things which have nothing to do with him, which reading his comments on that web site he obviously is.
[quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: Seems he's a professional... http://disqus.com/pe terhawkins1/[/p][/quote]Thanks for that link. Why should someone in France be commenting on something which doesn't affect him? - unless he has nothing better to do with his time than be a professional troll on things which have nothing to do with him, which reading his comments on that web site he obviously is. Carolyn43
  • Score: 4

9:53am Wed 5 Feb 14

RM says...

Carolyn43 wrote:
Jo__Go wrote:
Seems he's a professional...

http://disqus.com/pe


terhawkins1/
Thanks for that link. Why should someone in France be commenting on something which doesn't affect him? - unless he has nothing better to do with his time than be a professional troll on things which have nothing to do with him, which reading his comments on that web site he obviously is.
Seems best not to feed the troll.
[quote][p][bold]Carolyn43[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Jo__Go[/bold] wrote: Seems he's a professional... http://disqus.com/pe terhawkins1/[/p][/quote]Thanks for that link. Why should someone in France be commenting on something which doesn't affect him? - unless he has nothing better to do with his time than be a professional troll on things which have nothing to do with him, which reading his comments on that web site he obviously is.[/p][/quote]Seems best not to feed the troll. RM
  • Score: 3

10:00am Wed 5 Feb 14

RM says...

HRH of Boscombe wrote:
We should take our claim to the EU court. They're only an ethnic minority in British law.
.
They're F all in the EU
Nor are they recognised as an ethnic minority in Ireland, their own country -

http://itmtrav.ie/pe
tition/pview/5
[quote][p][bold]HRH of Boscombe[/bold] wrote: We should take our claim to the EU court. They're only an ethnic minority in British law. . They're F all in the EU[/p][/quote]Nor are they recognised as an ethnic minority in Ireland, their own country - http://itmtrav.ie/pe tition/pview/5 RM
  • Score: 3

11:08am Wed 5 Feb 14

smhinto says...

Just wondering how describing these travellers as mis-fits can be deemed as a racist comment is just beyond my comprehension. What a crazy world we are living in.
Just wondering how describing these travellers as mis-fits can be deemed as a racist comment is just beyond my comprehension. What a crazy world we are living in. smhinto
  • Score: 3

12:43pm Wed 5 Feb 14

The Reverend Peter Hawkins. says...

pete woodley wrote:
The Reverend Peter Hawkins. wrote:
kalebmoledirt wrote:
Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers
I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.
How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.
I "lived" in Bournemouth from 1938 until 1963.
[quote][p][bold]pete woodley[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Reverend Peter Hawkins.[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kalebmoledirt[/bold] wrote: Could the Reverend Hawkings speak to one of the faith schools that he is affiliated with and tell the staff and parents what a good Christian gesture it would to let this downtrodden ethnic minority camp on the playing field.then stand to get stoned by the downtrodden ratepayers[/p][/quote]I am Bournemouth born and bred, but can only afford to live in Breizh, Brittany, and here we have "Camping pour les forains" so there is no need for them to camp in the local Church school playground.[/p][/quote]How long did you live in Bournemouth,as you seem to have a short memory.[/p][/quote]I "lived" in Bournemouth from 1938 until 1963. The Reverend Peter Hawkins.
  • Score: 0

5:56pm Wed 5 Feb 14

cromwell9 says...

Dont worry BMTH residents,
The travellers wont use the Poole site .
Exeter last year .set up a simuler site .
66 Travelling familys turned up .
As soon as they asked them to register and pay council tax ,they all left except 6 .
This is just another Lib Dem scheme .It will be a waist of money .
Lib Dems always support the minority groups,They have these crazy ideas .
The trouble is It cost a Million pounds to put them right.
The travellers wont use it.They will leave 6 vans on the sight and that will be that .
Its not a criminal offence to trespass on Private land So the Police will have little powers to move them on ,
The Dorset Police a crime commisioner said We had a travelers site at the Dorset Steam Fair last Sept ,and it worked
Of course it worked.
That was their free time ,after the summer had ended.Before they left the area ,Otherwise they would of not used it .OOOPS.
Dont worry BMTH residents, The travellers wont use the Poole site . Exeter last year .set up a simuler site . 66 Travelling familys turned up . As soon as they asked them to register and pay council tax ,they all left except 6 . This is just another Lib Dem scheme .It will be a waist of money . Lib Dems always support the minority groups,They have these crazy ideas . The trouble is It cost a Million pounds to put them right. The travellers wont use it.They will leave 6 vans on the sight and that will be that . Its not a criminal offence to trespass on Private land So the Police will have little powers to move them on , The Dorset Police a crime commisioner said We had a travelers site at the Dorset Steam Fair last Sept ,and it worked Of course it worked. That was their free time ,after the summer had ended.Before they left the area ,Otherwise they would of not used it .OOOPS. cromwell9
  • Score: 1

3:01am Thu 6 Feb 14

portia6 says...

Born under a wandering star.
Born under a wandering star. portia6
  • Score: -1

12:15pm Thu 6 Feb 14

Dorset Logic says...

Can I just re-iterate that as a traveller, I would be to worried about crime to stay in Bournemouth.
Can I just re-iterate that as a traveller, I would be to worried about crime to stay in Bournemouth. Dorset Logic
  • Score: 0

11:58pm Thu 6 Feb 14

AdelaidePete says...

There is a perfect spot for occasional travellers which would probably upset nobody. Between Longham bridge, Kinson and Bear Cross is a large site away from residential housing. It is grassed over now and a few years ago was a rubbish tip. Years before that it was a flood plain where as a kid I used to wade through a stream bed, catch freshwater crayfish, try to catch the odd trout (unsuccessfully). Sorry, rambling on. Anyway; seriously it could be the perfect spot. (The main road surround is already full of trash)...
There is a perfect spot for occasional travellers which would probably upset nobody. Between Longham bridge, Kinson and Bear Cross is a large site away from residential housing. It is grassed over now and a few years ago was a rubbish tip. Years before that it was a flood plain where as a kid I used to wade through a stream bed, catch freshwater crayfish, try to catch the odd trout (unsuccessfully). Sorry, rambling on. Anyway; seriously it could be the perfect spot. (The main road surround is already full of trash)... AdelaidePete
  • Score: 3

Comments are closed on this article.

Send us your news, pictures and videos

Most read stories

Local Info

Enter your postcode, town or place name

About cookies

We want you to enjoy your visit to our website. That's why we use cookies to enhance your experience. By staying on our website you agree to our use of cookies. Find out more about the cookies we use.

I agree