‘Under siege’ Crown Estate publishes open letter after being deluged with post over Poole’s marina

Bournemouth Echo: POOLE: Crown Estate has made its position clear over marina bids POOLE: Crown Estate has made its position clear over marina bids

THE under siege Crown Estate has published an open letter after being deluged with post over its preferred bid for a Poole quayside marina.

Residents’ associations, Borough of Poole, town MP Robert Syms and others have written calling for more information and meetings with the body after it emerged it favoured a proposal which would see a bridge, road and car park built in the harbour.

Neil Jacobson, rural and coastal portfolio manager for the Crown Estate, said as they had received interest from more than one party – Poole Harbour Commissioners and MDL – they had to decide on a preferred bidder.

“In deciding between competing parties in such situations, The Crown Estate is required by law (the Crown Estate Act 1961) to make decisions based on the best commercial proposition.

“This is the standard approach that any commercial landowner would take under the same circumstances,” he said.

“The process surrounding the leasing of land is not the same thing as the statutory consenting process and does not require public consultation. The Crown Estate is not a regulator, planning authority or, in this context, developer.

“Local councils and other statutory authorities decide whether a prospective development proposal should go ahead and make decisions regarding the appropriate level of public consultation required of a developer during the statutory consenting process. The Crown Estate only grants a full lease to a developer once all necessary statutory consents have been issued. MDL has not yet been appointed as preferred bidder and we have made no commitments on when we plan to make a decision on this matter.”

He said they planned to review the situation in the new year. “The widely publicised ‘decision date of January 14’ is not a date which has been published by The Crown Estate and we have never committed to make any decision by that date.”

He added: “At this stage in our evaluation process our discussions with MDL are commercially confidential so we are not in a position to reveal details about their scheme.”

Comments (10)

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5:51am Fri 27 Dec 13

ShuttleX says...

If I have this right, Poole Council will make the decision on what is actually built on the site. Crown Estate will only lease the land out once that process has been decided. So what is all the fuss about? If you want this built, or that built, then camp outside the Council with your protests. All the Crown Estates have said is which building bid they would prefer. Obviously that is the one that will get them the most money. Nothing wrong with that. But the actually decision is not theirs, but the Councils.
If I have this right, Poole Council will make the decision on what is actually built on the site. Crown Estate will only lease the land out once that process has been decided. So what is all the fuss about? If you want this built, or that built, then camp outside the Council with your protests. All the Crown Estates have said is which building bid they would prefer. Obviously that is the one that will get them the most money. Nothing wrong with that. But the actually decision is not theirs, but the Councils. ShuttleX

6:47am Fri 27 Dec 13

RM says...

Shuffle X - good point but still alarming that the Crown Estate is happy (apparently) to prefer an option that would involve spoiling the harbour as it would make them more money. Would they be equally happy to consider a couple of high rise apartment blocks in the middle of Windsor? That too would be a very successful financial proposition as I'm sure many overseas visitors would be willing to pay through the nose to be able to boast that they had an apartment in the same town as the Queen.
Shuffle X - good point but still alarming that the Crown Estate is happy (apparently) to prefer an option that would involve spoiling the harbour as it would make them more money. Would they be equally happy to consider a couple of high rise apartment blocks in the middle of Windsor? That too would be a very successful financial proposition as I'm sure many overseas visitors would be willing to pay through the nose to be able to boast that they had an apartment in the same town as the Queen. RM

7:47am Fri 27 Dec 13

Justaman says...

I think the headline "under siege" is a bit dramatic. People are just concerned that the habour is not spoilt. However I do remember the concern about the Twin sails being built, it has been and is now an almost accepted part of the Poole infrastructure, admittedly having some teething problems. But works fine. I think we have to wait until we see the plans that MDL are proposing and to remember they have over 40 years in the business of building and running marinas. A marina will be built, progress needs to go forward for the local economy and boaters.
I think the headline "under siege" is a bit dramatic. People are just concerned that the habour is not spoilt. However I do remember the concern about the Twin sails being built, it has been and is now an almost accepted part of the Poole infrastructure, admittedly having some teething problems. But works fine. I think we have to wait until we see the plans that MDL are proposing and to remember they have over 40 years in the business of building and running marinas. A marina will be built, progress needs to go forward for the local economy and boaters. Justaman

9:29am Fri 27 Dec 13

adspacebroker says...

Dramatic is an understatement...alo
t of busy body hype. Lets not forget the people of Poole were duped by PHC when they came up with the Hamworthy marina idea....it got everyone spitting teeth. So when they said lets do a 900 berth marina on Poole Quay, everyone the townsfolk thought they had won...getting the better option. Now an expert marina company (MDL) come along with a better version that includes 300 less berths and a little car park (which is relevant to berth holders) it is sour grapes all round being instigated by the tears of PHC running to Poole Council shouting foul play! Crown Estates should be applauded for their conduct and moreso making the point that it is commercially sensitive....so who has seen the plans then, because I understand other than Crown Estates, nobody has yet!!! As I have said in a previous comment, MDL must be good if they have 20 odd successful marinas under their belt. PHC should just stick to chasing speeding Jet skis!
Dramatic is an understatement...alo t of busy body hype. Lets not forget the people of Poole were duped by PHC when they came up with the Hamworthy marina idea....it got everyone spitting teeth. So when they said lets do a 900 berth marina on Poole Quay, everyone the townsfolk thought they had won...getting the better option. Now an expert marina company (MDL) come along with a better version that includes 300 less berths and a little car park (which is relevant to berth holders) it is sour grapes all round being instigated by the tears of PHC running to Poole Council shouting foul play! Crown Estates should be applauded for their conduct and moreso making the point that it is commercially sensitive....so who has seen the plans then, because I understand other than Crown Estates, nobody has yet!!! As I have said in a previous comment, MDL must be good if they have 20 odd successful marinas under their belt. PHC should just stick to chasing speeding Jet skis! adspacebroker

9:49am Fri 27 Dec 13

dogsoftheworld says...

ShuttleX wrote:
If I have this right, Poole Council will make the decision on what is actually built on the site. Crown Estate will only lease the land out once that process has been decided. So what is all the fuss about? If you want this built, or that built, then camp outside the Council with your protests. All the Crown Estates have said is which building bid they would prefer. Obviously that is the one that will get them the most money. Nothing wrong with that. But the actually decision is not theirs, but the Councils.
Sorry but absolutely not. PooleCouncil have no authority in th harbour- their jurisdication ends at the Quay.
That's why this is all so wrong- there is no democratic procss in this decision. For Crown Estates read Prince Charlie, and their process is essentially feudal.
But neither scheme can exist in isolation- cars have to use Poole's roads for example. So in that regard Poole Counil have some leverage.
IMHO, the PHC scheme offers more to local people. MDL are just after the big bucks from the gin palace owners - as they always are. They are not in any way community minded,whereas PHC are. Give me 900 smaller berths over 600 bigger ones any day. And an executive car park in the harbour? Yuk!
[quote][p][bold]ShuttleX[/bold] wrote: If I have this right, Poole Council will make the decision on what is actually built on the site. Crown Estate will only lease the land out once that process has been decided. So what is all the fuss about? If you want this built, or that built, then camp outside the Council with your protests. All the Crown Estates have said is which building bid they would prefer. Obviously that is the one that will get them the most money. Nothing wrong with that. But the actually decision is not theirs, but the Councils.[/p][/quote]Sorry but absolutely not. PooleCouncil have no authority in th harbour- their jurisdication ends at the Quay. That's why this is all so wrong- there is no democratic procss in this decision. For Crown Estates read Prince Charlie, and their process is essentially feudal. But neither scheme can exist in isolation- cars have to use Poole's roads for example. So in that regard Poole Counil have some leverage. IMHO, the PHC scheme offers more to local people. MDL are just after the big bucks from the gin palace owners - as they always are. They are not in any way community minded,whereas PHC are. Give me 900 smaller berths over 600 bigger ones any day. And an executive car park in the harbour? Yuk! dogsoftheworld

10:16am Fri 27 Dec 13

sea poole says...

adspace -Applauded? When Crown Estates 'lost' the application from PHC? When Crown Estates subsequently 'found' the application after being threatened with legal action? Which part of that do you consider worthy of applause? Which part of MDL's 'presentation' do you consider worthy of applause when they refused to show plans? What's the use of any presentation when the audience can't see what's on 'offer?' Don't even YOU consider there's something not quite right within this?
adspace -Applauded? When Crown Estates 'lost' the application from PHC? When Crown Estates subsequently 'found' the application after being threatened with legal action? Which part of that do you consider worthy of applause? Which part of MDL's 'presentation' do you consider worthy of applause when they refused to show plans? What's the use of any presentation when the audience can't see what's on 'offer?' Don't even YOU consider there's something not quite right within this? sea poole

10:34am Fri 27 Dec 13

boyerboy says...

WE ( residents/lovers of the harbour et all ) have no say in this matter, neither do Poole Council( which may not be a bad thing....) but the whole process is of concern and farm yard smells may have some merit here.


I for one do not want to see any more of the harbour/shoreline etc built on ...and as for a car park in the harbour ..... suggest the"Crown" should instead build a new yacht haven in QE11`s back yard.
WE ( residents/lovers of the harbour et all ) have no say in this matter, neither do Poole Council( which may not be a bad thing....) but the whole process is of concern and farm yard smells may have some merit here. I for one do not want to see any more of the harbour/shoreline etc built on ...and as for a car park in the harbour ..... suggest the"Crown" should instead build a new yacht haven in QE11`s back yard. boyerboy

10:56am Fri 27 Dec 13

Tictock says...

Wake up people, Crown Estates have made it quite clear, it is a commercial business exercise. He who produces a plan that will generate the most money for Crown Estates wins, be it housing, marina or whatever, nothing new here.
Wake up people, Crown Estates have made it quite clear, it is a commercial business exercise. He who produces a plan that will generate the most money for Crown Estates wins, be it housing, marina or whatever, nothing new here. Tictock

3:13pm Fri 27 Dec 13

Ebb Tide says...

We should not let the name "Crown Estate" confuse us. The Crown Estate is controlled by Parliament (the Crown Estate Act refers) and 85 % of the proceeds goes to The Chancellor of the Exchequer / Government coffers - the balance to the Crown. Guess who is looking for ways to rectify the damage done by our abused and manipulated financial system ?

I was pleased to learn that some of us are obviously aware that "the validity of any transaction entered into by the Commissioners shall not be called into question". Not sure that any parliamentarian realized (in 1961) that perhaps they had awarded the Crown Estate" (substantially a governmental agency) some sort of immunity from review / challenge / correction.

I suspect that is the reason why vigorous challenge must (as a matter of civic concern) be given to any "proposed" transaction since no similar immunity has been given to proposed transactions, as distinct from actual transactions of the Commissioners !

Well done, I say to all that have expressed concern about the threat to 'localism' , the protection, reinstatement and improvement of our surroundings and the need to have clear, transparent and well timed plans that can be largely accepted by us in Poole. Many hands make light work - obviously Crown Estate must not be allowed to take any Cavalier actions that affront us - so am sending my letter too. What about yours ? !!.
We should not let the name "Crown Estate" confuse us. The Crown Estate is controlled by Parliament (the Crown Estate Act refers) and 85 % of the proceeds goes to The Chancellor of the Exchequer / Government coffers - the balance to the Crown. Guess who is looking for ways to rectify the damage done by our abused and manipulated financial system ? I was pleased to learn that some of us are obviously aware that "the validity of any transaction entered into by the Commissioners shall not be called into question". Not sure that any parliamentarian realized (in 1961) that perhaps they had awarded the Crown Estate" (substantially a governmental agency) some sort of immunity from review / challenge / correction. I suspect that is the reason why vigorous challenge must (as a matter of civic concern) be given to any "proposed" transaction since no similar immunity has been given to proposed transactions, as distinct from actual transactions of the Commissioners ! Well done, I say to all that have expressed concern about the threat to 'localism' , the protection, reinstatement and improvement of our surroundings and the need to have clear, transparent and well timed plans that can be largely accepted by us in Poole. Many hands make light work - obviously Crown Estate must not be allowed to take any Cavalier actions that affront us - so am sending my letter too. What about yours ? !!. Ebb Tide

2:33pm Sat 28 Dec 13

Justaman says...

sea poole wrote:
adspace -Applauded? When Crown Estates 'lost' the application from PHC? When Crown Estates subsequently 'found' the application after being threatened with legal action? Which part of that do you consider worthy of applause? Which part of MDL's 'presentation' do you consider worthy of applause when they refused to show plans? What's the use of any presentation when the audience can't see what's on 'offer?' Don't even YOU consider there's something not quite right within this?
I have seen a rough copy of MDLs' marina plan, go to Cobbs and ask to see a copy.
[quote][p][bold]sea poole[/bold] wrote: adspace -Applauded? When Crown Estates 'lost' the application from PHC? When Crown Estates subsequently 'found' the application after being threatened with legal action? Which part of that do you consider worthy of applause? Which part of MDL's 'presentation' do you consider worthy of applause when they refused to show plans? What's the use of any presentation when the audience can't see what's on 'offer?' Don't even YOU consider there's something not quite right within this?[/p][/quote]I have seen a rough copy of MDLs' marina plan, go to Cobbs and ask to see a copy. Justaman

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