Only 34 traffic cops left in Dorset (From Bournemouth Echo)
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Only 34 traffic cops left in Dorset
9:39am Friday 11th January 2013 in News By Paula Roberts
Commissioner: Martyn Underhill
DORSET has lost a third of its traffic cops in the last year, figures have revealed.
The number of officers specially trained to deal with traffic incidents has fallen from nearly 50 in early 2012 to 34 full time equivalent posts now.
The cull is due to savage Government funding cuts and comes at a time when the number of lives lost on the county’s roads rose by almost a third in 2012 from 19 to 25.
Dorset’s Police and Crime Commissioner Martyn Underhill said reducing the number of people killed or seriously harmed in road accidents is one of his key priorities over the next five years.
But added with the force having to find another £13 million worth of savings by 2014/15, he simply does not have the resources to hire more traffic officers.
The Commissioner added: “I don’t’ think the deaths are connected to the reduction in traffic officers. We all know the main reason is that people are not driving responsibly.
“There are no plans at present to cut any more but I also have no plans, or resources, to increase the traffic department at Dorset Police.”
Clive Chamberlain, chairman of Dorset Police Federation, said: “It is genuinely worrying – traffic cops are concerned about what’s happening but it’s due to funding and how the force prioritises its services.”
He added: “Deaths or injury on the roads still remains the most significant harm to the public in Dorset.
“There has been an increase in our road deaths and there are now less people available with the specialist knowledge to deal with them.
“Technology in some areas has replaced officers which is what I feared would happen. But speed cameras are one dimensional – they only take a photo or record a car going at a certain speed.
“They cannot tell whether someone is drink or drug driving, driving dangerously or whether the car is stolen.”
Cllr Michael Filer, Bournemouth council’s Cabinet member for Transport, added: “This is very worrying news. I am concerned particularly about safety and I will be taking this up at a meeting with the police and the Police and Crime Commissioner.”
Earlier this week the Echo reported that 25 lives were lost in 23 road accidents in Dorset last year.
Dorset’s top traffic officer Insp Matt Butler said the biggest factor in road deaths are the ‘fatal four’ – severity of injury due to not wearing a seatbelt, excess speed, not paying attention, and drink or drug driving.
Speaking about the tragic road death toll, Mr Underhill said: “I extend sympathy to those families and friends who have lost loved ones through horrid road tragedy.
“I will continue to highlight to the Government the importance of properly-funded road and traffic policing.
“I would like to remind road users to pay attention, expect the unexpected, slow down, always wear your seatbelt and never ever drink and drive. By doing so lives are saved."
Comments(32)
Teddy 1
says...
9:51am Fri 11 Jan 13
It's all very well to keep hitting speeders with fines and courses after the event to raise more money to hit more speeders but does the profile of speeders caught match the profile of those having collisions.
Wake up...maybe a change is needed at the top and a more radical approach!
bsjc1234
says...
9:52am Fri 11 Jan 13
The Renegade Master
says...
9:55am Fri 11 Jan 13
It's time YOU did something about this sorry state of affairs Mr. Underhill and ended this disgusting policy that borders on entrapment. These officers should be catching real criminals, not acting as tax collectors for HMRC.
pete woodley
says...
9:57am Fri 11 Jan 13
speedy231278
says...
10:02am Fri 11 Jan 13
Teddy 1
says...
10:06am Fri 11 Jan 13
rayc
says...
10:12am Fri 11 Jan 13
That is a travesty when it is said in relation to the number of lives lost on the county’s roads rising by almost a third in 2012 from 19 to 25. I am sure that the two people crushed to death in the tunnel wee not driving irresponsibly and was driving a factor in the death of the lady who fell on the bus? Was the coach driver who killed the soldier running along the A35 in the dark prosecuted for any offence?
The reason deaths are increasing is because they include events that are not fatal collisions in the real meaning of the word. What are Dorset Police doing to target people such as the pair killed after they took a car without the owners consent whilst under the influence of alcohol?
What a hypocrite Clive Chamberlain is. He says " But speed cameras are one dimensional – they only take a photo or record a car going at a certain speed" but it is the Police who lied through their teeth when they said that by introducing cameras they would free up traffic officers to concentrate on serious moving traffic offences. You cannot believe a word of any of them and until the Police understand how their public support has fallen due to their sponsoring of Dorset roadsafe nothing will change.
The Renegade Master
says...
10:34am Fri 11 Jan 13
rayc wrote:Top post rayc as usual. Well said.
The Commissioner added: “ We all know the main reason is that people are not driving responsibly".
That is a travesty when it is said in relation to the number of lives lost on the county’s roads rising by almost a third in 2012 from 19 to 25. I am sure that the two people crushed to death in the tunnel wee not driving irresponsibly and was driving a factor in the death of the lady who fell on the bus? Was the coach driver who killed the soldier running along the A35 in the dark prosecuted for any offence?
The reason deaths are increasing is because they include events that are not fatal collisions in the real meaning of the word. What are Dorset Police doing to target people such as the pair killed after they took a car without the owners consent whilst under the influence of alcohol?
What a hypocrite Clive Chamberlain is. He says " But speed cameras are one dimensional – they only take a photo or record a car going at a certain speed" but it is the Police who lied through their teeth when they said that by introducing cameras they would free up traffic officers to concentrate on serious moving traffic offences. You cannot believe a word of any of them and until the Police understand how their public support has fallen due to their sponsoring of Dorset roadsafe nothing will change.
Hessenford
says...
10:38am Fri 11 Jan 13
Last week at the Castle Lane traffic lights near Tesco I witnessed two cyclists run red lights from both directions, the car drivers next to me and in front of me were on their mobile phones and one was not wearing a seat belt. five offences went unchecked with a speed camera only fifty yards away, actually six offences if you include my own stupidity, although I retaxed my car during the last week of December and received the new disc in the post four days later I had not replaced the old disc in my car, I have now but still an offence never the less.
Speed cameras are an expensive non entity which only detects one offence and does not reduce accidents, traffic cops move around, cameras dont.
itsallgammon
says...
10:44am Fri 11 Jan 13
All I'm trying to say is, give the man a chance and try and keep politics and hobby horses out of it
Old Colonial
says...
10:45am Fri 11 Jan 13
Nor do you have the authority to influence operational matters, that is expressly excluded from the remit of a PCC. So what can you do?
rayc
says...
10:59am Fri 11 Jan 13
itsallgammon wrote:The only reference in my post to speed cameras was the quote from Clive Chamberlain. You obviously do not agree with him, as is your right, that the Police failed to keep their promises that introducing cameras would free up traffic officers to concentrate on moving traffic offences.
Same old, same old, rayc banging on about speed cameras, the Renegade Master inevitably agreeing. Bitter posts from people I presume are failed candidates or supporters of those political parties that put up candidates, lost and can't accept democracy (sorry that's a dirty word to some on here!). Those that bothered to vote elected an ex police officer who has not been in office very long. The issues raised are endemic to the country not just our area. This is Dorset not Hollywood so no magic wands are available.
All I'm trying to say is, give the man a chance and try and keep politics and hobby horses out of it
I voted for the independent candidate at the PCC elections with no second choice so no I did not support a failed candidate. I do not attach any blame to the PCC for the historic actions of the Police in sponsoring Dorset roadsafe. I will blame him if we just have more of the same and he does not clarify and justify how the profits from the Driver awareness courses is spent.
It will be interesting to see whether he is able to keep politics and hobby horses out of it as that is what Clive Chamberlain and Insp Matt Butler are bringing into it.
The Liberal
says...
11:07am Fri 11 Jan 13
BIGTONE
says...
11:33am Fri 11 Jan 13
Marksimmo
says...
11:38am Fri 11 Jan 13
Several points from my perspective.
1) The PCC cannot influence operational policing, so why are they trying to comment on increasing or not traffic officers - as to do so would adversley affects some other aspect of the operational effectiveness of the Force.
2) Speed cameras are a blight. They do nothing except alienate the public and the above comments are true, they do not affect overall road safety. For that you need officers and its no use looking at every officer you see as a Traffic guru, as they all do different things but our lack of knowledge on policing makes us tar all with a same brush when nothing appears to be done.
3) CYCLISTS. That was the best point made. We have cops and PCSO's etc and no one deals with cyclists anymore. Let an old lady or young child get hit by a modern zippy cyclist and there is a chance if not seriously injured, that they could die. But unfortunately as everyone always does, they look at the perpetrator as being the victim. So a pedestrian, getting wiped out by a cycle and injured (as I witnessed yesterday) in Boscombe pedestrian precinct, must have been their own fault for walking where cycles cannot be heard approaching and should not be ridden. So its ok for convenience of or the cyclists safety to put more vulnerable road users at risk, ignore several other laws than them behave responsibly.
4) Comments from officers - I think need to be considered in context. Im sure ideas at one time were correct in the context expressed, but with cuts, changing opinions etc they can look daft when taken out of context.
5) If your loved one dies on the road, then its a traffic cop you need to deal with it. If you kill someone on the road, even by accident, you could go to prison. We take cars for granted but actually they kill more people or affect more of our lives for the worse than possibly any crime poss does. I remember going to a public meeting and the senior officer there (Forget his name) pointed out that all crooks travel by road, all stolen property must at some stage be taken in a car, speed as a cause contributes 60% of all road deaths, unisured drivers cause misery to those that they affect but unless you have a system of policing to address this you cannot blame a cop everytime he stops a car. If you are doing nothing wrong, you have nothing to fear, but teh fact you did nothing wrong is not known to the officer when he stops you unless he has ESP. If he doesn't stop someone you know he should, you then call him useless and ignoring his job - but you wont tell him whats up because he hasn't got ESP and you dont believe in being a grass.
Hang em all I hear people cry - oh unless its me that gets caught in which case the officer should have shown discretion and dealt with it by way of a warning and rather than being professional I will slander him as officious and on a power trip who wont listen to my drivelly lame excuse..
Policitics is only in Policing because politicians think they can win viotes and now we have an extra tier in the PCC.
WHATS THE PCC going to do about the oik who scratched my car the other day. I havent reported it because Dorset Police will only record it and IF im lucky to see someone it wont even be a cop but a PCSO who seem to think they are something they are not.
The most truthful thing I ever heard a cop say was when my mate got stopped and tried to say he would never help the Police again (hoping that may make him let him off).
The officer, was very calm and pointed out' You will need to call me for help, before I will ever need to call you - but I will always do my best to come, despite what I think of you!'
My question would be - 'How long before we realise that we have created a void that cannot be filled and anarchy rules the street, with noone there to tackle it?'
Allyssia
says...
11:41am Fri 11 Jan 13
pete woodley
says...
11:43am Fri 11 Jan 13
skydriver
says...
11:48am Fri 11 Jan 13
That said its about time the police or the PCSOs started handing out tickets for parking all across the footpaths ,it's ok with wheels just on the walkway but more often than not the whole car is on the path, this is totally unacceptable, action now please.
gileto
says...
12:13pm Fri 11 Jan 13
rayc
says...
12:29pm Fri 11 Jan 13
The article is of course alarmist as the Police announced years ago that they were reducing dedicated traffic officer numbers and reassigning them to general duties. We were told by Dorset Police, announced in the Echo I believe, that this was a good thing as their traffic experience would be used by general Police Officers in the course of their duties.
Confused and amazed that 12 years on from those days when the original Dorset Police mouthpiece Inspector Chalke promised so much, that this annual increase / decrease in fatal and serious collisions is used by the authorities to justify whatever is the whim of the day.
Clive Chamberlain
says...
2:32pm Fri 11 Jan 13
http://www.thisisdor
set.net/news/8327084
.Cameras____should_b
e_replaced_by_police
_officers______says_
union_leader/
The Renegade Master
says...
3:50pm Fri 11 Jan 13
itsallgammon wrote:I didn't vote and I have little interest in politics.
Same old, same old, rayc banging on about speed cameras, the Renegade Master inevitably agreeing. Bitter posts from people I presume are failed candidates or supporters of those political parties that put up candidates, lost and can't accept democracy (sorry that's a dirty word to some on here!). Those that bothered to vote elected an ex police officer who has not been in office very long. The issues raised are endemic to the country not just our area. This is Dorset not Hollywood so no magic wands are available.
All I'm trying to say is, give the man a chance and try and keep politics and hobby horses out of it
I do agree with rayc where it comes to speed cameras, but if you read my post a little earlier I commented on what these highly trained traffic police actually do.
I think their time would be best spent out there on the roads looking for dangerous drivers, the uninsured/taxed, cars that are MOT failures and of course the drink/drug drivers. This should be their priority, not hiding in a bush round a blind bend on a road that's had it's speed limit deliberately reduced to a level way below what it was built for, specifically to snare safe drivers who may be a few mph over that artificial speed limit for revenue generation. It's an absolute disgrace that this policy remains in place and it does nothing except cause resentment from the majority of motorists toward the police as they feel they are being wrongly targeted. Those who set policy must end this sharp practice now, NO EXCUSES!
Lord gungedin of Ferndown
says...
5:06pm Fri 11 Jan 13
Teddy 1
says...
8:11pm Fri 11 Jan 13
pete woodley
says...
8:25pm Fri 11 Jan 13
Teddy 1 wrote:police ,blame council,council blame police,have a look at Columbia rd by draycott rd.
Well said skydriver...too many people parking on pathways and then being aggressive when challenged when pedestrians can't pass....truth is the police are just not interested or can't be bothered to investigate and take action.
Marksimmo
says...
10:34pm Fri 11 Jan 13
pete woodley wrote:Parking problems are generally the responsibility of the Council, not the Police who have no power to deal with general parking offences - except obstruction.
Teddy 1 wrote:police ,blame council,council blame police,have a look at Columbia rd by draycott rd.
Well said skydriver...too many people parking on pathways and then being aggressive when challenged when pedestrians can't pass....truth is the police are just not interested or can't be bothered to investigate and take action.
So in Poole where Parking attendants drive around in gangs of 5 in a people carrier, starburst, issues loads of tickets and scream off before anyone realises - or drive up and down videoing cars from a video car, if they cannot issue a ticket (and make money for a skint council) then to them it must be a Police problem.
If the PCC really wants to save the Force money, then stop other organisations misusing police time and resources to fill their own gaps and shortcomings.
If we want the police to enforce the law, then stop them being misused by councils and similar. Why do they misuse the Police? ................ because they can and they know that the system means the police cant say no, even if they want to. But most of this has nothing to do with law enforcement and so when some poor person gets caught by a cop breaking the law, they scream foul!!!
Marksimmo
says...
11:14pm Fri 11 Jan 13
So the Govt are saying that a 14 year old can make an adult like informed decision about a life changing lifestyle practice, where physically if not mentally they have not matured sufficiently, without recourse to the advice or support of an older more wise person. The fact they contemplate it suggests they believe many 14 year olds based on the liberal society already created can cope.
But if a 16 year old, beats the hell out of my car, because he can, then out of me when I try and stop him, and then he fights the Police who try and arrest him and all the time whilst drunk at 16 in public, given the age of criminal responsibility is 10 in this country, nothing will happen because some social liberal do-gooder will argue that he did not understand what he was doing BECAUSE he is 16 and that he cant be asked simple questions like 'why did you do it' without an adult being present to make sure he understands the question.
And when at 16 he cycles home on the pavement in dark clothing on a bike with no brakes (coz thats not cool to have brakes), no lights, possiblly riding down a one way street the wrong way , ignoring the provision of many a high cost funded cycle lane in place, giving the 'bird' to any driver who toots their horn correctly in accordance with the highway code to alert the idiotic cyclist of their presence and throughout presents a risk to their safety and that of others. But get stopped by the Police (unlucky to happen I know) then they are picking on him, he should have been given a warning, he is only 16 so didn't understand (not sure what the parents have done for the last 16 years then) and whilst he issues a tirade of abuse at the officer for daring to pick on him, claiming the officer is out of touch with the youth, doesn't know how to speak to young people blah blah blah, he then makes a complaint that the officer may have used an inappropriate word to deflect attention. Because he now has to walk home, the parents complain that the extra time it takes placed his safety in jeopardy ignoring the risk he took riding the cycle in the first place and that he should have had a free lift home at tax payers expense.
So when does a young person become responsible entirely for their own conduct? Is it 10, 14, 16. 17 or 18 because they can do somethings at some ages that they cant do at others, but it seems upside down.
I suppose this has a loose connection as more cops out would tackle firstly the misuse of cycles (which are dangerous in many riders hands) and secondly the issue of criminals using cycles or riding stolen cycles.
The Police need to get back to basics, ignore the do-gooders and ensure that people are punished appropriately, but then again the police have no say in who gets prosecuted anymore.
jill M
says...
10:11am Sat 12 Jan 13
pete woodley
says...
10:42am Sat 12 Jan 13
jill M wrote:I fully agree with you there jill,no slanging,no malice,nothing personal,no foul language,no calling anyone by their surname,no bringing up unrelated history or issues,no bullying.Keep the comments coming in.
Marksimmo, you would get my vote if you ever want to go into politics, how nice to read intelligent, informed opinions on here!
rayc
says...
9:49pm Sun 13 Jan 13
There were therefore 36 Traffic Officers after that initiative and now there will be 34. So were there actually 50 last year 2012 as the article states? The figures do not stack up unless there has been some creative bookkeeping. These Traffic Officers were not sacked, they were reassigned and if the CC wanted to he could reassign them back to traffic if he considered it a priority.
dorsetspeed
says...
8:05am Thu 24 Jan 13
Great to see that someone connected with the police (Clive) realises the weaknesses of speed cameras. But maybe his job doesn’t depend on them, perhaps Matt Butlers does though: Only one of the things he lists stands out for real as a “biggest factor” – not paying attention. And absolutely nothing that Dorset Police does deals with this.
Having investigated road safety and Dorset Police extensively and totally independently (i.e. without ANY financial reward / motivations) for nearly 10 years, the only conclusion I can reach is that Dorset Road Safe have greatly damaged public trust and road safety and are completely dizzy with the amount of money they are making on courses, in reality, if they are managing costs competently, a staggering 700% profit, and people are paying with their lives and livelihoods for this greed.
Mr Underhill is dealing with some fairly serious issues with Dorset Police / DRS including a complaint the IPCC have upheld and something far more serious, resulting from my investigations. This will test his integrity to the full, we will know very soon if saving life is his really his primary concern.
ajj-dorset says...
9:48am Fri 11 Jan 13